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[00:00:00] Christina: You are listening to Overtired. I’m Christina Warren joined as always by Brett Terpstra and Jeff severance. Gunzel how are you guys doing

[00:00:13] Brett: Oh, oh, I mean, tired. That’s appropriate

[00:00:17] Christina: I, I mean, it is the name of the podcast that I came up with like seven years ago, eight years ago. Oh my God. While we were tired.

[00:00:25] Brett: in an elevator. Yeah.

[00:00:27] Christina: an elevator at Twitter at Twitter

[00:00:30] Brett: Oh, that’s right. It wasn’t the Twitter HQ. Wasn’t it.

[00:00:33] Christina: it was

[00:00:34] Jeff: That’s a good origin story.

[00:00:37] Brett: speaking.

[00:00:38] I, I

[00:00:38] have, I have some great news for you guys. Um, speaking of Twitter, this podcast has been acquired by Elon Musk. Um, which

[00:00:47] Jeff: Oh, I

[00:00:48] Brett: news. We no longer have to do sponsor reads. Uh, we also, we’re not

[00:00:52] Jeff: have to come into the office.

[00:00:54] Brett: negative about Elon or Tesla or SpaceX. Um, all jokes [00:01:00] have to be what Elon determines to be funny, but Hey,

[00:01:04] Christina: okay.

[00:01:05] Brett: you know, we’ll roll with it.

[00:01:05] I’m obviously

[00:01:07] Christina: I mean, look, this is what happens sometimes.

[00:01:09] Brett: lying.

[00:01:10] Christina: Clearly. I mean, because look, I will say that if Elon wanted to offer us like a shitload of money to sell out, um, I would totally do it.

[00:01:19] Brett: What’s your price?

[00:01:20] Jeff: for a ride space

[00:01:22] Christina: I, yeah, I don’t know. I mean, I don’t

[00:01:25] Jeff: without, without him a board. Sorry, go ahead, Christina.

[00:01:29] Christina: No, no. It’s to say what my price would be. I mean, like for this pod, it, it would be cuz here’s the thing we could always just recreate our own thing. Like, you know what I mean? Like if, if, if, if it went to shit, so I don’t know, it wouldn’t even have to be that much.

[00:01:41] Like it, it would have to be something, but,

[00:01:43] Brett: would, for me, for me, it’s about 5 million, because if it was anything less than that, if anything, less than that, I could parlay that, Hey, we are a podcast that Elon offer $4 million for. So I could parlay that into other buyers. [00:02:00] If we were worth that to Elon, there’s some, there’s some legs to that 5 million though.

[00:02:05] I’m I’m I I’ll sell out. It’s

[00:02:08] Jeff: I’d do it for a pocket full of McDonald’s gift cards.

[00:02:11] Christina: I was, I was like, I was thinking more like 50,000 and I’d be like,

[00:02:15] Brett: oh my God.

[00:02:16] Christina: yeah. Oh, I

[00:02:17] Jeff: Mm-hmm

[00:02:17] Brett: I make that in a minute.

[00:02:19] Jeff: mm-hmm you know what though? How cool would it be if we only recorded the podcast from space? So every week we took a trip. and we recorded in space and that was our bit.

[00:02:31] Christina: That, that

[00:02:32] Brett: We record

[00:02:32] Christina: cool. That’d be cool.

[00:02:33] Brett: would all three of us in a space shuttle recording a podcast. Why

[00:02:38] Jeff: it’s a monthly podcast.

[00:02:40] Brett: Why does the ISS not have a podcast?

[00:02:43] Jeff: I mean, they’ve got enough social media coming out of them.

[00:02:46] Brett: I haven’t paid attention. Do they?

[00:02:49] Jeff: Yeah. They’ve always got someone who’s good at working it up there. Just

[00:02:52] Brett: Huh? We have a social media intern at work now and I don’t want to talk shit. So that’s all I’m gonna say.[00:03:00]

[00:03:00] Jeff: literally just talked shit.

[00:03:02] Christina: I was gonna say like, like, like now, now, now, now, because you’re gonna have to be the one who, who, who potentially edits this segment out of it. So you’re like, I don’t wanna talk shit, but is this someone like you’re working closely with, like, this is this an intern on your team?

[00:03:14] Brett: This is an intern on my team who yesterday I was supposed to be in a meeting to assign them, to help them learn copywriting. And I missed the meeting. I feel really bad cuz Victor had to take that meeting on his own, he was hired as an intern to do social media, but he wants to get his hands dirty in copywriting. He wants to start blogging for us. And my, my S spitey senses are tangling. I doubt he listens to this podcast.

[00:03:48] Jeff: know what

[00:03:48] Christina: I’m

[00:03:49] Jeff: he did,

[00:03:49] Christina: does not.

[00:03:50] Jeff: if he did, it would be the first five minutes. So you really should’ve, should’ve stopped this one at the end.

[00:03:57] Christina: It’s true. It’s true. But, but I [00:04:00] feel pretty strongly

[00:04:01] Brett: kicking off strong. And I

[00:04:02] Christina: Yeah, but I was gonna say, like, I feel very strongly that this, this kid is absolutely never going to listen to this podcast or look at your Twitter or look at the social media of like any, any person who is

[00:04:12] Brett: feel like if anyone else on my team listens to this, they’ll just smile and nod and be like, yep.

[00:04:19] Christina: And, and if, if they don’t, if they’d be like, oh, did you mean so? And so you’re just like, no, you know, like if they’re upset

[00:04:26] Brett: no. The other social media

[00:04:28] Christina: exactly, exactly.

[00:04:30] Jeff: Oh, that’s an

[00:04:30] Christina: they don’t know you’re you’re remote. You don’t know.

[00:04:32] Brett: you ain’t know me.

[00:04:34] Jeff: We’re fucked up. We broadcast from space. It just messes with your head.

[00:04:38] Christina: Yeah. I like it. I’m

[00:04:41] Jeff: did you see that guys?

[00:04:44] Brett: Um, Jeff you’re driving. Tell us

[00:04:47] Jeff: Oh, that’s right. I’m driving. All right, everybody get in and maybe go to the bathroom first. Just at least try. Um, which is what we tell our kids. Just try. That’s not true. They’re all like grown. They’re like grown men now, but [00:05:00] that’s what we used to tell. 'em um, give it a push. Not that’s the kinda shit that does come out sometimes.

[00:05:06] And, and, and my wife quickly, like, Hey, just, you know, wait till they’re older.

[00:05:10] Brett: it a good push

[00:05:11] Jeff: um, okay. Let’s do, um, a mental health check here, uh, and see, I wanna see how you are doing cuz uh, you know, it’s been a few days only, but Christina, how are you doing

[00:05:23] Christina: okay. Um, so I, uh, I’m going out of town this weekend and I’m gonna be gone for like 10 days, uh, my first international trip in a couple of years. So I’m excited about that, but I’m also, you know, a little bit like not nervous, but just it’s the first time I’ve done this in a while. So. You know, trying to get back in the, in the swing of things.

[00:05:40] I know you’re in a similar position. Um, Jeff and you’re going further away and, uh, to, uh, like you’re doing more important things than me. Um,

[00:05:49] Jeff: things? No, I’m just traveling.

[00:05:52] Christina: I thought you were like doing this for like work or like,

[00:05:54] Jeff: No, that that was my Spain trip that I canceled. I, and everyone who went got COVID. But, um, [00:06:00] but yeah, this is just my family. Not just, this is my family trip to Kenya, but you’re headed out. You’re on an international trip. That is daunting after a while

[00:06:07] Christina: Yeah. Yeah. You know, I’ve, I’ve done like the domestic travel, um, quite a bit, but I haven’t, I haven’t been like, you know, on a, on an airplane for like 10 hours at a time in a while. Uh, yeah. No, so I’m, I’m I’m okay. Uh, I, um, I had to test, uh, for, for COVID because I was exposed to someone, but I am negative. I will test again, um, like Friday I leave Saturday.

[00:06:28] So I’m, you know, making sure that I’m gonna do all the right things, but I’m feeling fine. So I’m good on that front. Um, And, uh, we we’ve had a, a person coming in and, and cleaning our, um, our apartment and helping get us organized. And that’s been really, really good for my mental health. It was daunting at first.

[00:06:45] I think we were gonna talk about this a little bit,

[00:06:47] Brett: gonna have to talk more

[00:06:48] Christina: but, but, but yeah, but, but we’ll we’ll table that, but I just wanna say, like that is actually having tremendous impact on my mental health, even though that was a very stressful thing at first.

[00:06:57] Brett: but in a good way now.

[00:06:58] Christina: Yeah. Yeah. Like [00:07:00] just the fact that it’s getting done, like is, has really like relieved a lot of things for.

[00:07:05] NyQuil.

[00:07:06] Jeff: Yeah. Wow. That’s great. That’s great. Yeah, we’ll talk about that. How about you, Brett whiskey?

[00:07:12] Brett: I, um, I continue to be stable months without a manic episode, which is it’s. It’s great. I I’ve been having, I, I wake up these days at like 3:00 AM every day and I have to take like, what’s that I take this, like over the counter sleeping medication to fall back asleep. Uh, Psalm something. No, not NyQuil. Uh, I can’t remember.

[00:07:40] I’ll I’ll, I’ll bring the bottle with me next week and tell you what’s working for me. whiskey. Um, no, uh, but, but I’ve been dreaming a lot about cocaine. I really, uh, being stable apparently makes me crave drugs. Um, I feel like that’s [00:08:00] come up for a few weeks in a row now.

[00:08:02] Jeff: Mm-hmm

[00:08:03] Brett: I’m clean, I’m sober, I’m stable.

[00:08:07] And I, what, what more could you ask for, I mean,

[00:08:12] Jeff: shit.

[00:08:14] Brett: I mean, other than, you know, dying in a drug-fueled binge

[00:08:22] Jeff: No, don’t ask for that now. I guess,

[00:08:24] Brett: no, my cat, my cat started vomiting blood yesterday or a couple days ago.

[00:08:30] Jeff: full time. Hold on. I’m just trying to imagine

[00:08:33] Brett: Mortality. I just, I

[00:08:34] Jeff: Oh, okay. Got it. Got it. Got it. Got it.

[00:08:37] Brett: flip to mortality because I’ve been just dreading the end of life for Yeti for so long now.

[00:08:45] And he’s been through this before, where he’s vomited blood and we got him on new meds and we actually, I wasn’t even sure that meds were doing anything anymore, but we missed one day of the meds and then we found blood on the floor. [00:09:00] Um, and it’s made me realize that we’re, we’re keeping him alive, maybe past his.

[00:09:07] His due date, but, uh, but it, it always brings to mind like mortality for me. Uh, yet he’s been with me for almost 20 years now and he’s, he’s my confidant. He’s my friend. He, he has lasted longer than any relationship I’ve ever had. My life he’s been there for it. Uh, so the fact that he is clearly reaching end of line, uh, EOL, I, uh, or EOF even, um, it’s, it, it it’s, there’s a whole process for me, but, but mental health wise, I’m growing out of beard. Which I feel is indicative of my stability. Like I am able to grow a beard. Yeah. Like cuz when, when I’m manic I [00:10:00] tend to shave I don’t know why I just like get out the Clippers and I just do all of my head and everything, but the, the listeners can’t see this, but you guys have to say this salt and pepper beard I have going is looking pretty good.

[00:10:15] Jeff: really?

[00:10:16] Brett: I have homemade cocoa butter and bees wax beard ball in it. It’s shiny. It’s it’s got a lot of gray in it and I, I love the gray anyway. Anyway, Jeff, how are you?

[00:10:30] Jeff: Also bearded. Um, I’m doing pretty good. I had the first time ever, I, since I think I’ve been taking Citraline for like two years and for the first time ever, I went without for a couple days, cuz I ran out on a weekend and just hadn’t properly. Sometimes it gets refilled on its own and you get used to it.

[00:10:50] But anyway, and on day two, I was like, I spent the whole day just feeling so off and so like dizzy. And so just kind of like just, just, [00:11:00] I just did not feel good. And I realized like, oh, it’s been two days and I’ve always you that’s one that you’re told, like you don’t, you don’t just stop that one. Um, and so I feel like it must have been the beginning of what is the reason that you don’t stop it.

[00:11:12] So got, got it going again in time, but that was a, it was kind of like humbling, you know, to realize.

[00:11:19] Brett: Been there recently running

[00:11:21] Jeff: Yeah, you were there. I know this was you, I think like last week or something, but, uh, and, uh, and now I’m in this situation of trying to do the math for my meds to make sure that like, say my trip to Kenya goes from two and a half weeks to four, cuz something goes wrong.

[00:11:35] Like wanna make sure I got what I need so anyway, just kind of doing math and stuff, but good. Pretty, pretty much, uh, just good. Otherwise good.

[00:11:44] Organize This

[00:11:44] Jeff: Now I wanna talk about this personal organizer situation because Matt, Christina, why don’t you set it up for us a little more? Like what, whatever you’re you’re comfortable saying, like what is it that led you to get one?

[00:11:56] Was it hard to get one? And what’s it like now that you have one.

[00:11:59] Christina: [00:12:00] Yeah. I mean, so, I mean, she’s, she’s not even, I would say it’s kind of probably, I don’t know. We can call her personal organizer though. That’s kind of the role she’s playing, but we needed like, like deep cleaning of our apartment. And my office has been just like filled with boxes of stuff that I’ve bought that I haven’t opened and like all kinds of other things that have just kind of like been accumulating and.

[00:12:19] It’s just kind of been this, this, um, process where I’ve been overwhelmed. I’ve like wanted to be able to kind of get in and like get everything cleaned and organized and whatnot. But I just, it’s been, uh, mentally like overwhelming for me. Like I haven’t been able to, to do it. And, and just even the thought of doing it has been really overwhelming.

[00:12:36] And so we just, we found someone on, um, TaskRabbit and now we’re, we’re paying for her off TaskRabbit through, through, um, Venmo because, you know, fuck those fees and stuff. Um, and she’s been really, really good. She’s come in a, a few times already. She’s already made a lot of progress and, um, I’m just like I, at first was really like uncomfortable and kind of like freaked out by the fact of like somebody seeing [00:13:00] like, kind of like my office, the state it is as it is and other stuff.

[00:13:03] And like, I was like, I don’t know how I feel about someone going through my stuff and all of that. And I just kind of was like, you know what, fuck it. Like. This isn’t gonna get done unless I have someone helping and, and frankly doing a lot of the work, which, which is in this case, just kind of like, you know, organizing things and, and, um, and then I can kind of, you know, make my go through piles and, and figure out what I wanna keep and get rid of and stuff like that.

[00:13:27] But, uh, but it’s, it, it was one of those things that like, it was difficult at first to kind of get over that like mental hump of letting someone in my space, but it got to the point that it was so like bad that I was just like, actually I don’t fucking care. I just need this done. And now I feel so much better.

[00:13:45] Jeff: Mm. And, and how about, what does it feel like now compared to what you expected? What does it feel like to have that person in a room? Just kind of moving around, doing deep, cleaning, whatever,

[00:13:56] Christina: really nice. And, um, I’ve also, I haven’t been around for a [00:14:00] ton of it. Grant has been here. I’ve like, I was actually, it wasn’t even planned, but I was like in the office, uh, yesterday, uh, recording something. And so I, you know, wasn’t even there for that part of it. Some of the other times, like it, it’s kind of up to me with how I wanna, how much I wanna directly kind of engage with this.

[00:14:16] I think as, as it goes on, I’ll be engaging with her more, but I’m, I’m at least for kind of the first pass of things. I’m just kind of letting her do, like get it to a certain state where I can then be helpful if that makes sense.

[00:14:28] Jeff: totally. That’s awesome. That’s really awesome. I, I, uh, was finally talked into getting, uh, actually like a team of organizers. Like I, in our basement, we have various rooms that are not used and stuff just gets kind of stuffed in there over the years. And I keep a lot of what, uh, what I’ve sort of generated or collected over the years.

[00:14:50] I like kind of jokingly say I’m a high functioning hoarder, which is actually Adam Savage’s bit, but it’s a. A bit. Um, and, uh, and, but [00:15:00] finally got to the point where I’m like, I, I do not wanna spend time on this. Like I’ve, I’ve gone through things over the years and purged things, but it kind of all just like ends up sort of gathering up again.

[00:15:11] But I was just embarrassed to have somebody come in, but then I, like, my wife found a couple of options, sent me the options and we picked this group, this organization, and three women came, uh, and just like went down into the basement for a day and then another day. And they just like made sense of things and, and, and made their own sense of things.

[00:15:31] I wasn’t like, Hey, this should be here and make sure to look for this, like what was very hands off? And it felt amazing. Like I was so stressed before they came in and, and man, it felt amazing to have someone else dealing with it. And in the end they were like, maybe there’s just say this to make you feel good.

[00:15:46] But they’re like, this has been really fun. You have really cool stuff. I’m like, oh, thanks. Cuz generally I just look at that stuff and think I am the worst person in the world. I loved it.

[00:15:55] Brett: them, did you let them into your office? Do you have like an area that you consider, [00:16:00] like your sanctum, like this is, this is myself personified in a room and it feels very invasive to let anyone in it.

[00:16:11] Jeff: there’s just not anything they could do in here. Like I have some piles and stuff like, but mostly it’s like, it’s a small room and it’s just kind of got the essentials in it. So I wouldn’t feel that way, but they did that. They, we actually had them go into my workshop, which is very much like a place that only I go and it was just gotten really out of control and they did that too.

[00:16:32] It was just like, they just handled it and they had fun doing it. And like, it was just the most amazing feeling. And it really, um, it did, it did wonders to take away some of the shame or some of the like, ah, don’t go in there kind of feelings

[00:16:46] Brett: that’s the way I feel about my office and my bedroom. Like the rest of the house, please come in, help me out, organize this stuff for me. But my office and my bedroom are very much, [00:17:00] they feel like extensions of my brain and they’re messy and they’re chaotic. And they are like, I can find everything most of the time, if it’s within the last year, I can figure out where it was.

[00:17:15] Um, but it feels like a real, a very personal, very intimate thing to let anyone else. I don’t even let, I don’t even let L into my office, like. Feels like such an invasion to me. And it could like, I need it. I need to get this place organized. I feel like my brain would work better if I got this shit under control, but you can’t see off to the left and right of the camera here, but there are shelves that I have just Contin.

[00:17:50] I consider them like archival storage and, and it’s not, it’s not horrible. Like, I, I could show it to you. You’d be like, that’s not so bad, [00:18:00] but it does. It does affect my brain. And I do think I could benefit if I was willing to let someone in.

[00:18:06] Jeff: Mm-hmm mm-hmm yeah, I recommend it.

[00:18:10] Christina: Yeah, I do too. And, and I think that like, it’s, it’s hard to like let people in and do it, but I don’t know, this was kind of like my take on it. I, I kind of don’t care at this point, what someone thinks of my mess and my other stuff, like I would obviously would not want, like, if it was something that I knew and interacted with all the time and, and not to be different.

[00:18:30] Right. But I, I, I kind of got, I kind of don’t care. It’s like, I, I need the help. And I’m sure that they’ve seen worse and that they haven’t seen worse. Well, now they have like a story to tell for the future, you know?

[00:18:43] Jeff: Yeah, exactly.

[00:18:44] Brett: tale.

[00:18:45] Jeff: Or making memories. Yeah. And also, like I found, I don’t know if this was true for you, Christina, but I found it was one of those things that you, that I sort of worried about, worried about worried about. And the second it got started, I felt fine. Like, it was like [00:19:00] the second they got in and started doing work and I left the room.

[00:19:03] I felt fine. And then just felt fine. I felt great. So yeah. Yeah. I recommend it.

[00:19:12] Brett: Just as an aside, just as an aside, somebody tweeted yesterday. I, I tweeted about like how it’s great living when you have executive function disorder. It’s great living with someone else who has executive function disorder, because there’s just so much forgiveness and the relationship and someone tweeted me back that, uh, it was great to have me out there as someone that could hold up for their daughter to say, look, this guy also has executive function disorder and, and he creates a lot of cool stuff.

[00:19:45] And that was, it was very heartwarming.

[00:19:48] Christina: Aw, that’s really nice.

[00:19:50] Brett: I for, for once I’m not the cautionary tale

[00:19:54] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah. Right, right, right.

[00:19:58] Brett: should we do a, should we [00:20:00] do a sponsor break?

[00:20:01] Christina: Uh,

[00:20:02] Brett: will, uh, Christina always does the Zac reads. You want me to do the Zac read

[00:20:09] Christina: I

[00:20:09] Brett: you got it?

[00:20:10] Christina: I can do it. Um, what are you feeling?

[00:20:13] Brett: I, I feel like you are the

[00:20:16] Christina: the Z doc person. All right.

[00:20:18] Brett: reads.

[00:20:18] Jeff: to that. yeah.

[00:20:18] Sponsor: ZocDoc

[00:20:18] Christina: Well, I am, I am a long time. Z doc user, so finding in booking a doctor who’s right for you doesn’t need to be a terrible experience. Will they take your insurance? Will they understand your needs or be available when you can see them?

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[00:21:07] Millions of people use Zoc and I’m one of them. It’s my go-to basically anytime I need to find a new doctor and, uh, I’ve, I’ve used it in, you know, three different cities. Um, I don’t even know at this point, how many different insurance plans it’s really, really good. I highly recommend it. You can go to zoc.com/ Overtired and download the Zoc app for free.

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[00:21:46] Brett: Nice read. How do you guys feel about doing ad blocks? Where we just put all the ad reads together?

[00:21:53] Christina: I mean, let’s do it.

[00:21:54] Sponsor: TextExpander

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[00:22:50] It’s that easy text expanders available on Mac windows, Chrome, iPhone, and iPad and Overtired listeners. Get [00:23:00] 20% off their first year. Just visit text expander.com/podcast. To learn more about text expander as always a big thanks to smile.

[00:23:10] Jeff: Hmm, smile everybody.

[00:23:12] Christina: Smile. Thank you. Smile. And Texas fan is the best as we talk about many times on gratitude or we’ve mentioned over

[00:23:20] Brett: Like tech expander also sponsors my blog and we do, I have a purchase order every year. Uh, and you know, there’s no guarantee it will continue, but for maybe five years now, they have bought one ad a a month on my blog and have consistently, so it, it forces me to continue writing my blog because otherwise my blog becomes just a series of text expander ads.

[00:23:52] Christina: the years when they do their spots. So, yeah. Right.

[00:23:53] Brett: like, I am 100%. Like if someone wanted to call me a text, expander, chill, I’d be like, yeah, It’s it’s an [00:24:00] amazing app. And, and they, they pay good money for me to talk about them. Um, and I have no qualms with doing it, but if my blog were to get to the point where it was like three text expender ads in a row, and there was no other content in between on the main page, then I would feel bad.

[00:24:18] So it, it prompts me to continue.

[00:24:22] Christina: I like.

[00:24:23] Astronaut Competency

[00:24:23] Jeff: I love it. Um, I have a story to tell, so my dad was in town. He lives in Iowa and he collects and, and restores vintage speakers. I, and by that, I don’t just mean like boxy speakers. I mean, these are electrostatic speakers. They’re crazy. They can be sometimes like six feet high and just like an inch thick.

[00:24:43] They’re like the craziest thing. And they sound so freaking good. And there are so many weird variations of them. And so he found, uh, this set of speakers in Stillwater, Minnesota, which is about 45 minutes, uh, away from Minneapolis. And he came all the way from Iowa. [00:25:00] To hang out with me. Sure. But also to get these speakers.

[00:25:04] So I went with him cause I loved getting stuff off of Facebook marketplace, actually. Like I’ve almost, I’ve had almost like only positive experiences, especially if it’s like something that is sort of a specialty year into like a kind of tool or like in this case, weird speakers. And so we got to this guy’s place and he, um, he had his tractor all ready to move the speakers from the, uh, basement to the upstairs drive.

[00:25:29] He was about 83 years old. Um, he was moving real slow and. We were just kind of getting to know him a little bit before we went down and checked out the speakers and it turned out that like he just kind of dropped that he had been an engineer on the Apollo, um, Moom program and that he had designed the, um, he was one of the people designing the stabilization stabilization mechanisms in the command module, um, and actually would train astronauts in how to use it before they would [00:26:00] go to the Moom and.

[00:26:03] I, you know, those kind of moments don’t happen that much. Right. But they happen enough. And when they do, I realize that my brain goes into this desperate, oh my God, all this knowledge is gonna be lost mode, even as I’m just calmly and coolly, kind of having a conversation. Right. Like I know I can’t get all that knowledge.

[00:26:22] That’s gonna be lost before he goes, I’ll never see him again. But like, it is so striking. It just like, it just washes over me. As soon as I recognize someone holds some piece of, of kind of obscure history like that. Right. And it’s so striking how so many people. Whose names we will never hear or read, hold some piece of, of history.

[00:26:45] I tried to get something out of him. I used, I have kind of a sort of journalistic technique, which is like, so he had to go train astronauts. Right. And astronauts are obviously very, very competent people, right? Like they’ve gone through so many filters to get [00:27:00] to the point where they’re allowed to go to the Moom.

[00:27:02] It’s not like Elon Musk who can just go based on fucking money alone. Like these, these astronauts, like really, really brought a lot to the table. And, uh,

[00:27:12] Christina: and like literally put their life at risk, right? Like, like, and not a small way.

[00:27:15] Jeff: yeah. I mean, they’re driving a thing that’s like less powerful than like, I don’t even know what anymore. It’s not even not enough to say less powerful than my phone.

[00:27:23] It’s like way less powerful than my phone, this computer that got them to space. Right. But anyway, um, what I tried first was like, The kind of, I call it the, these fucking guys huh. Approach where I’m like, okay. So I got, I got a question for you. Like you’re down there training the astronauts and, and everybody knows the astronauts and everybody, you know, loves the astronaut astronauts are so smart, you know, but you’re training them.

[00:27:47] Right? Like, was there anything that they just weren’t good at getting, and, and he looked at me and like saw right through me. And he is like, uh, no, they were astronauts . And I was like, I was talking about [00:28:00] dad later. I was like, that technique is called the, these fucking guys. Huh? Technique, you know, just waiting for him to be like, well, yeah, buzz Aldrin, man, that guy, I don’t know how he passed second grade, but didn’t happen.

[00:28:11] I’m not looking for shit talking exactly. Right. Like, it’s a story that’s been told and told and told I want something

[00:28:17] Christina: Right.

[00:28:18] Jeff: uh, but my dad was able to talk to him more on, on technical terms. He actually had questions about the stabilizing mechanism, turns out that he’s been sitting on for a while. Um, but it was just this like really incredible thing.

[00:28:29] And then he was also selling all his like hand radio stuff. And then he started talking about how he was really into computers in the early days and that he owned an Aire computer that he no longer that he no longer owns, but, and I was like, well, wait, he’s like, I have a bunch of computer stuff that I haven’t brought up for the sale yet.

[00:28:45] I was like, wait, like, like what? And he’s like, well, some Dells, I was like, damnit, how did we get from ter to Dell’s? I really thought, you know, for just a minute, I thought like I had hit the jackpot, you know,

[00:28:56] Christina: And he is just like, no, actually, like I have some really good shit, [00:29:00] but also some Dells, you know, as one does.

[00:29:02] Jeff: then he listed the models. I’m like, no, I don’t. We’re good. I don’t need to know what model Dell you

[00:29:08] Brett: 3 86 DX

[00:29:10] Jeff: Yeah. but he

[00:29:11] Brett: sure it’s AgeWell

[00:29:12] Jeff: he also had a sweet laser disc player and about a hundred laser discs. Oh man. Which is pretty exciting. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, that was super exciting. And it was cool.

[00:29:23] Cause um, he had written out the schematics for this speaker. My dad picked up and this is cool to go through these schematics and be like, oh, this guy wrote schematics for the command module. The, you know, this is cool. Anyway, I, I tell this story just to say how much I love those little moments and how much I almost achingly realize.

[00:29:41] Even with more, much more modern history, even modern history of our own kind of interests. Right. And the, the kind of like tap culture, we live in whatever, like how many, how many people there are that own, just a piece of that history. And that it’s really despite that, how we document stuff much better.

[00:29:58] Now there’s so much that’s [00:30:00] in between, uh, the stories we know that, that we’ll never know, cuz that person is never gonna tell somebody and then they’re gonna be gone. So nice. Not trying to depress you.

[00:30:12] Brett: much do you think you could get for an Oscar computer these days?

[00:30:17] Jeff: oh Lord. I don’t know. Am I supposed to look it up? Is that part of the test?

[00:30:21] Brett: don’t know. I, I

[00:30:22] Jeff: really have internet in space.

[00:30:24] Brett: sold one for basically the equivalent of a gram of heroin. Um,

[00:30:29] Christina: okay. What, okay. What, what, what is, and same, and also what is an Oscar

[00:30:33] Brett: Oscar was one of the early suitcase computers where the front of it came off and it was a keyboard with a small monochrome green screen had a 300 bod coupler modem built into it. And a floppy disc drive that I think was five and a half, maybe seven. Uh, I can’t remember what F floppies it took, but it was, it was an early and I had an at [00:31:00] and T machine too.

[00:31:01] That was just another suitcase computer that I picked up at garage sales. And I’m pretty sure they would be more valuable today than they were 20 years ago, but I let them both go. For drugs. And, uh, I, I could have started, uh, a computer museum at some point.

[00:31:23] Jeff: That’s true. Look what you did and now you

[00:31:25] I recently, uh, I was recently given a TRS 80 portable computer.

[00:31:30] Christina: Oh, shit. Those are

[00:31:31] Jeff: they called it the trash 80. Um, and, and it came from a, a friend who had been a reporter at the star Tribune back in the eighties and had, had to take it on some, on a south Pacific trip.

[00:31:44] Um, and

[00:31:45] Christina: model 100, right?

[00:31:46] Jeff: yeah, the one that’s. Yeah, it’s just got like a screen. That’s about yay. Big.

[00:31:50] Brett: yeah.

[00:31:51] Christina: the, the model 100 is like, this is before my time, but it is so cool. Looking like people are making modern versions of it.

[00:31:57] Brett: The first computer program I ever [00:32:00] wrote was on a trash ad with one of those little screens. Yeah.

[00:32:03] Jeff: well. One of the things he gave me was all of the paperwork that the start Tribune put together for him on how to connect, uh, to the, to the phone and like, whatever. But it says at the top trash 80 instructions which is pretty awesome, but he had it, it’s not there anymore, but he had programmed in like a star wars game.

[00:32:21] I’m sorry. It’s space, invader game, star wars game it’s space’s game. Uh, which I’m sure was like 4,000 lines of basic. Um, but it’s my goal to do that. Maybe I’ll take that on the plane with me and

[00:32:32] Brett: space invaders written in logo.

[00:32:35] Christina: Oh, shit. That’d be so cool. Yeah. Um, uh, somebody created, so like the, the framework laptop that I’ve talked about a couple of times, um, the, they, somebody like has an open source project where they’ve created like a frame deck that basically is highly inspired by the, the model 100 trash 80 and, and, uh, it’s, it’s really, really, really beautiful.

[00:32:54] I’m gonna, um, put it in, uh, our, um, chat [00:33:00] and, uh, and, and we can see it. It’s really good.

[00:33:02] Jeff: I was thinking about the framework because one of the, you know, the sky was selling a bunch of hand radio stuff. And one of the things that electronics nerds back in the like sixties would do is buy Hef kits stuff, which were these just kits that would make anything from like a ham radio Transer to a color TV.

[00:33:20] My uncle made a color TV, uh, out of a kit. And what was so incredible is to look at, he had ton of these that he had made the quality was so incredible. Like the casing was so, so solid. And, you know, and it’s just maybe think like, there isn’t much like that today, but the framework computer kind of makes me think of that.

[00:33:37] Like

[00:33:37] Christina: Yeah. Yeah, I totally, I totally agree. Like it it’s, it’s, uh, I mean, you know, it’s definitely like a mass produced thing, but it is definitely like I, and I’ve, I’ve had like numbers of conversations with people on their team and stuff and, and they very much care about what they’re doing, which is cool. And I’m, I’m glad that like a year later, like I’m still very happy with it and, and I’m glad that they are, are still, you know, checking along and seem to be being successful, which, [00:34:00] um, was not a, a.

[00:34:02] At all. So, you know, because it’s, it’s a commodity space and they’re doing something that’s very different from what other people are doing.

[00:34:10] Jeff: And they’re kind of the first to really get something like that off the ground

[00:34:14] Christina: yeah, honestly, yes, honestly. Yes, because like, what was shocking to me and we don’t need to talk about this anymore, but like, was that what I got was, so was basically exactly what was promised to me, which never happens with these sorts of things. And, um, I’m looking forward to when the, um, main boards for the 12th gen Intel processors are available this summer.

[00:34:38] I’m gonna buy one of those and put in my laptop and then I’m gonna take the 11th gen main board that I have. And, and, you know, do some sort of DIY thing with it because like, you know, like they’re really encouraging that, which is really cool,

[00:34:50] Jeff: Yeah, people are doing such cool stuff. It’s like it’s own, it’s like become its own weird version of the raspberry pie.

[00:34:56] Christina: kind of, kind of just much more expensive.

[00:34:58] Jeff: Way more expensive. Yeah. [00:35:00] That’s cool though. that’s awesome. Um, okay. I, I, I have another topic in here.

[00:35:06] Dotfile Love Letters

[00:35:06] Jeff: I have a couple topics for today. Uh, and I think this next one will be quick and the one after that will be longer.

[00:35:12] Okay. So I want to talk about, I, I just, something happened to me just before we were recording and I thought was so sweet. Um, a friend of mine, my friend a was turning me on to this, um, music library, uh, like CLI called beats, um, B E E T S. And it was something I was just looking for something like that for a while.

[00:35:36] And, and, uh, so we were going back and forth about it and I was kind of looking at it and playing with it. And then he said, you want me to send you my config file? And I thought that is such a developer love language. Like, cuz I just felt touched . I was like, yes, I would like to see your config file. exactly dot files is left letters. I remember that [00:36:00] happening with you Brett, at one point you shared some things and I’m like, well, this just feels special.

[00:36:04] Brett: Yeah, like I have a, my dot files. Repo is private. Um, like I keep it on my son analogy on a, in a get repo on my son analogy instead of publishing it to GitHub because man dot files can be very personal.

[00:36:19] Christina: yeah, I was

[00:36:19] Brett: kinda like letting someone into organize my office.

[00:36:22] Christina: no, I was gonna say mine are private too. And I’ve, I’ve like, I I’ve gone back and forth about this because there’s a part of me that like, would like to make. At least what I have kind of open at least maybe like parts of it, then there are other parts I’m like, I really, exactly would be like someone reading through.

[00:36:39] Yeah. It’s like someone going through your, your, your office. It is exactly like that. The difference is is that if you have it on GitHub and like, mine is just in a private GitHub repo, but like you could basically have like, you know, thousands of people driving by and like looking at, and, and silently judging you versus just the person that you pay to do a service who you never have to interact with again, after [00:37:00] that, that is over, you know?

[00:37:01] Jeff: like that. Yeah,

[00:37:02] Brett: Or, or there could be thousands of people benefiting

[00:37:05] Christina: Right. That’s the problem.

[00:37:07] Brett: but yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s that line of like, what is, what’s gonna get me judged versus what’s gonna actually help somebody. And then in a lot of cases, I feel like. There is somebody out there less experience than me who could benefit from what I figured out, but I haven’t figured out so much that I feel comfortable with them taking my lead.

[00:37:31] Christina: Right. Yeah. So, so it’s interesting you say that, cuz cuz actually both of these things are interesting and I love the whole idea of like these things as being like love letters. So it’s um, it’s maintainer month, uh, this month, um, which, uh, is a GitHub thing, but, but it’s not just GitHub. We, I think are like the, the chief sponsors, which is basically kind of like dedicated towards, um, talking about and uplifting and, and like celebrating, you know, people who maintain open source projects.

[00:37:56] And um, we had a summit of this week, um, for, [00:38:00] um, it was a, a private thing for, um, some of the larger maintainers in, in the ecosystem. And I met like people who are doing these amazing things and like people that I’m, I was like totally fangirling because I was like, oh my God, I, I love your project and, and what you’re working on and things like that.

[00:38:15] And I, I was, so I’ve been thinking a lot about exactly what you just said, which is like, Where that line is between, I know more than a beginner and a newbie, and I wanna help them out, but I don’t know so much that I feel like, you know, they might not get in, in trouble based on following what I’m doing.

[00:38:36] And, and I think that that’s like a common problem. I think with getting contributors to open source projects is, is kind of at that line. And, and I, and I sometimes feel like, I think that we all judge ourselves maybe a little bit too much and, and, and think like, it’s gotta be perfect and I’ve gotta be a super expert before I can let anybody take a look at it when no, you know, you, you can, as long as you are being accurate with what you’re [00:39:00] describing, you know, okay.

[00:39:02] Worst case someone might, you know, get stuck and it might not be for them, but like, okay, cool. They can move on and find something else. But best case you might find somebody who is really helped by it. And it leads them to doing other stuff or, you know, even better contributing to, to what you’re doing and helping you go further.

[00:39:19] Brett: uh, so like marked, um, my app marked I will never open source. Uh, that code is. Only I could ever understand that code. And I really think it would do more harm than good for any developer to see it, uh, doing, which is all written in Ruby has been refactored many times over the years, but it’s actually, you could learn a lot.

[00:39:49] If you were new to intermediate in Ruby, you could pick up a lot of stuff from doing, because I have, I have learned so much about Ruby [00:40:00] just over the years and, and learned from other people and, and doing I’m happy to open source and it is open source. Like anyone can dig into it, but bunch, uh, which is the most recent Coco app I’ve developed.

[00:40:16] Uh, it’s still an objective C, which dates it a little bit. But I actually put years of what I learned from fucking up marked. Uh, I put into coding, do a bunch from scratch and I’m tempted to open source it because I’m not, I’m not nearly as embarrassed by it as I am of mark.

[00:40:42] Christina: Yeah. And, and I think what would be cool if you did that? Cuz because I totally agree with you. Like I, this is something that I like. I have ideological differences with some people who are really active in an open source. I do not believe that everything should be open source. Um, I think that freedom goes both ways and you can choose to not have something there.

[00:40:59] Uh, but I was, I [00:41:00] was actually on the one password podcast a couple weeks ago. Uh, and this topic kind of came up, which is like, how can like close source, you know, companies or developers or what not still contribute. And I think what you kind of laid out is, is, is that right? Like for you is not even so much about being embarrassed.

[00:41:15] Cuz I think that you could get around that. It’s about the fact that like the code for, for marked isn’t in a good enough place for it to be useful. Like you said, it could be actively harmful and other people aren’t going to understand it. And I think the problem that we see a lot of times with people with, with, you know, Sometimes with, especially drive that’s they kind of call it like drive by open sourcing.

[00:41:35] They throw it over the wall, but they don’t do anything with it. And I’m of the opinion, like, look, you can do whatever you wanna do. And if you wanna make everything, you, you do open, that’s completely fine. And like, you don’t owe anyone, anything. I get that. But I feel like if you, like, for me anyway, it feels like if I’m making something open source, I’m putting, especially if it’s something like an app that, you know, like runs and it’s not just like maybe like a, [00:42:00] a personal project that you’re just kinda like, look, if you wanna look at it fine.

[00:42:03] But, but you know, in this case, like it’s, it’s something that people could actually get use out of. Um, I think that you, I think that you kind of have that obligation a little bit to, you know, have it in, in a good state so that other people can learn from it. And, and that, you know, is that takes time and that takes effort.

[00:42:20] And I, and, and you’ve gotta think about that. And so, but I, I also have to say like, If you could take the things you’ve learned with marked and, and you’ve done it with bunch also, just the fact that bunch, I think is one of those apps more than marked that you could really have other people hacking on and helping with, and like doing things contributing back in a way that could also be fulfilling for you as well.

[00:42:43] Jeff: mm-hmm

[00:42:43] Brett: Yeah. Um, speaking of developer love letters though, of, of would you call it developer, love languages? I, uh, I regularly interact with other independent developers and there’s this, [00:43:00] like, you don’t give your source code away for free. Uh it’s by, you know, in a non open source app, a closed source app, you don’t just give away source code.

[00:43:12] And like, I worked with the guys from Ulysses years back and I just, I wanted to replicate something they were doing with RTF code and I gave them thousands of dollars for what amounted to maybe like four pages of code. Um, and, and I learned my lesson that. Generally I can figure shit out on my own, but in my interaction with other indie developers, I have found a lot of people that are like, oh yeah, I know exactly how to do that.

[00:43:49] Here’s the sec section of the code from my application, half the function calls in it won’t work for you because they call other proprietary functions of my own. [00:44:00] But this is, you can see from this, how this thing would work. And it has been so helpful to me, uh, like Daniel J cut from red sweater, uh, Craig Scott from I thoughts, uh, or to wear like those people have shared code with me, uh, um, uh, rich from bare bones. Like these people have given me code that has changed the way I do things. And it is like that kind of sharing that is very much a love language. Like that is like, I recognize you as someone in the vein of what I’m doing. Like we have similar goals and I’m going to share with you my private code. And that absolutely feels like a very loving gesture to me.

[00:44:51] Christina: Yeah, no, that’s, that’s actually amazing. And, and, and that’s so interesting, right? That like, you know, again, like, I guess how it differs. It’s like, okay, I see [00:45:00] you. And I’m going to do this solid and know that I won’t have to support any of it or whatever, but, but just show you like, okay, this, this, this is where you wanna look and try this out.

[00:45:09] And, and this, this is probably gonna do what you needed to do. That’s awesome.

[00:45:12] Brett: And I’ve, I’ve returned the favor, like

[00:45:14] Christina: Oh,

[00:45:15] Brett: times Andreas Hegenberger guy who does better touch tool. Like we’ve traded quite a bit of code. Um, especially as I worked on bunch and wanted it to do some of the things that better touch tool does. And yeah, man, those relationships, they feel very, they feel deep to

[00:45:34] Christina: Yeah. I, I, I think that they’re definitely deep. And I think that, that, like that says a lot about you when you have so many people who, and, and, and, uh, like who both you share things with, but who are willing to share with you. And it has to feel awesome as a dev, like if, if a w respect is willing to give you

[00:45:49] Brett: You have no idea, like how big a deal that is to me to have to have someone that, like, when I first started using a Mac, it [00:46:00] was the indie community that. Made me realize I was in the right place. And, and I immediately developed heroes, you know, from, uh, who made text mate,

[00:46:12] Christina: uh, oh, macro mate. So Alan oar.

[00:46:14] Brett: Ellen agar, a AARD agar,

[00:46:18] Christina: I don’t know,

[00:46:20] Brett: agar, a guard it’s agar, Ellen agar to, to an odd guard, to, to rich, to Daniel JK.

[00:46:27] Like these are my early heroes, uh, like back in like the year 2000 and, uh, and to be exchanging code with them these days, it it’s a huge deal to me. It means so much.

[00:46:42] Jeff: kind of gets back to that piece of that, that bit about kind of pieces of history people hold, right. I mean, especially when you think about the the like fields of, uh, video game archeology and, and other kinds of like digital and code based archeology, like the idea that, you know, you hold [00:47:00] some piece of some moment in time in that code and they hold some piece of some moment in time.

[00:47:06] It’s so interesting. Kind of fits both those topics.

[00:47:09] Christina: does. It does. And it makes me once again, just like remind myself of like set up, like I’m gonna like, uh, set up a recurring, I give to them annually, but I think I’m gonna set up a recurring, like monthly donation to the internet archive because the work that they do is so important. And I do feel strongly, like, I, I would hope at some point, even if you’re terribly embarrassed by like the source code for, you know, um, for, for marked that, like, if, you know, you were, if you decided like I’m not gonna do anything with this or whatever, or let’s say like, you have it, like in your will or something, you’re like, okay, I’ll, I’ll put, I’ll put this on.

[00:47:40] You know, whether it’s, whether it’s compiled or UN compiled or whatever, I’ll put it on the internet archive so that people in, in the future could. Do something with it and get it running again and, and keep like the history of, of what it was around. Because when we discover things like when, when 3d movie maker was, was recently like, [00:48:00] like the code was, was open sourced and the community got it.

[00:48:03] Building and windows, modern versions of windows and, and like the fan community around that really rallied. And it came because a guy like tweeted, he was like, Microsoft won’t do this. And, and they did. And they even got like the, the rendering engine, which Microsoft had purchased. They even got the author of that to, to agree to, to MIT license.

[00:48:20] It, like you have whole generations who missed certain things who then, because of bit rot and other stuff can’t experience it. But when you have people who are willing to also like, kind of find a way to archive some of that knowledge, cause some of it’ll obviously die, but I think whatever we can do to preserve that is really important.

[00:48:39] Brett: Yeah. It’s like, there’s a short, there’s a short in, in the grand scheme of things. The life term of code is, is pretty short, like envi, uh, like notational velocity is open sourced. Uh, and I would estimate that within the next two OS updates, [00:49:00] uh, it won’t be able to compile anymore. Um, like the app might still work for a while, but compiling will become nearly impossible.

[00:49:09] Like there’s a lifespan on these things, but yeah, open sourcing, open sourcing, dead code can still be beneficial. I think.

[00:49:20] Christina: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that, that was what was sort of cool about the, the 3d movie maker thing, which I don’t know if either of you ever used, but like, that was, it was, it was like, this is what makes me in nineties. K. But it was an app that came out about the same time that windows 95 came out. And it basically let you create, like, it’s kinda like the metaverse like you create these 3d worlds, like you’d have a camera that you could control and you had like buildings and objects and people, and you could move things around and animate them.

[00:49:45] And then you could export, you know, the movie file that would only play in this kind of weird esoteric format, but you could, you know, add soundtracks and stuff and basically create your own little movies. It was really cool. And for a lot of people, it was like the first for me, certainly it was the first time I’d ever.

[00:49:58] Even had the idea of being like, [00:50:00] oh, I could create my own 3d worlds. Right. And, and you got a sense of like what animation was like and other stuff and, and the, the community around it, which has kind of remained, you know, it’s not massive, but like, there are still people who are dedicated to it. Um, some of the stuff they’ve done over the years, like is just really creative, but it, it doesn’t, you know, run like, like the old exc file.

[00:50:20] Like you could do certain hacks, but it wouldn’t run under modern versions of windows. And so now, because the source code and the rendering engine, which was actually used in a lot of other games too, is on GitHub it’s archive. So it’s not like, you know, people are taking pull requests, but there’s been this like, you know, fork of it, like, uh, 3d mm.

[00:50:38] Forever that, you know, people are, are now doing stuff too. And, and it’s just cool to see the fact that even if you’re not gonna be adding anything to it, right. Just the fact that people like. Kids today could see something they think is cool and they could run this and, and play with what their parents might have built, which is depressing to say, but you know what I mean?

[00:50:58] Like, like you could, but [00:51:00] you could do that, which, you know, that’s one of the things that sort of scares me and makes me sad about mobile apps is that, well, the web too, but really mobile apps is that we don’t have archives of this stuff. And even if we did, we don’t have a way to be able to, you know, like play back and, and open and run those files, which is, which is kind of sad.

[00:51:19] Jeff: Right. Like talking Carl, anybody, remember talking Carl, the, the iPhone app.

[00:51:25] Christina: No,

[00:51:26] Jeff: He was a little squishy, adorable red guy, and you would say something into the, uh, phone, and then he would say it back and hi voice and . And it was, and, but what’s funny about that is, I mean, just to take this kind of further in the same direction is that.

[00:51:43] Talking Carl was an app that my friend Jonathan, um, turned beyond to that very much, um, reflected his humor. He’s dead. And I can’t play talking Carl and, and I feel like that’s some of the ways in which I feel I’m kind of thinking out loud here, but [00:52:00] one of the things that, um, all of this makes me think about is the way in which, you know, historians will have so much more data of course, and so much more to work with, but they’ll also have so many more tools with which to work with that so much more data.

[00:52:17] Um, and, and so like that idea of just making sure that there’s some way in which, uh, an iPhone app from way back when can be resurrected, because it’s part of someone’s memory of someone, right? Like just interesting feels like we’re in, in so many ways, obviously we’re in like a transitional moment, like.

[00:52:37] Epoch, but especially now, and that is just one of those little nuanced ways in which that’s the case. Hmm, wow.

[00:52:43] Brett: I dug up an iPhone one, three, and fours, uh, just going through like should I needed to sell. And, uh, and I got them all to boot and realized there are apps on there that at one [00:53:00] point I considered essential and I loved, or, or considered really fun. And I love that that don’t exist and won’t run on any modern operating system.

[00:53:11] They’re like little relics from the past that I can only run on these phones that are basically garage sale material at this point.

[00:53:19] Grapptitude

[00:53:19] Jeff: Uh, yeah. Interesting man. Well, this is a nice segue into gratitude.

[00:53:26] Brett: Oh

[00:53:27] Jeff: I mean, I would do talking Carl, but I already did it. somebody’s starting. I’m gonna look up talking Carl.

[00:53:32] Christina: Okay. Um, I’ll start. So this is one that I actually, um, uh, discovered relatively recently, but I was using it this week because I was having to create some, uh, videos, uh, for, uh, for work for the, for the product team. And, um, that also included some, some gifs because yes, I say jifs for the, the social media stuff and, you know, converting like, uh, videos into, into jifs and making them not look terrible is not a super easy [00:54:00] process, but there is a command line tool called GSKi GI F SK.

[00:54:05] And there’s also an open source Mac app that is, is a front end for the same thing. And it is so good and it is so useful. Both of them are, are just great. So that, that is, that is my gratitude, but I also wanna go a little bit further because the creator of the, the Mac app, um, his name is, uh, I’m not sure how you say his name. He’s uh, he’s a European, um, uh, CiDRA Sohu, uh, S I N D R E S O R H U S. And he is awesome. Like he’s I think the person who created like awesome lists and, um, so no pun intended there actually, but he’s also has a bunch of open source Mac apps, and then a few of them that he sells in the store and he’s got, uh, he’s like basically able to, to do.

[00:54:49] Full-time open source stuff based on people being patrons of him and whatnot. And he just contributes a ton of stuff to the community and does really good things. But, um, but I really, really appreciate, [00:55:00] um, Ky, both the person who created kind of the library for it. And then, um, his front end, which he created because I was able to take like a really big, like, like not really big, like I had like a minute and a half video that I needed to cut down to like a 32nd G and I was able to do it with this app relatively easily.

[00:55:19] And then also adjust like the quality, the size and the number frames per second, and then get in a, in a file size that would work on the various social media sites. And it looked really, really good. And that is typically like a lot of the converters, like some of the ones that, you know, like, like Jiffy and, and some of the other like, like, uh, there used to be one called like, I think like, like J bartender or something like that, like

[00:55:41] Brett: uh, there’s one lively, uh, iPhone app lively does a pretty good

[00:55:46] Christina: Yeah. And, and like, those things are, are cool, but, um, and, and for the iPhone, that might be like what your best option is. But if you are on a Mac like this particular library, it’s, it’s GI S is the, the URL. Um, they use [00:56:00] like a, a high quality, uh, G and coder based on, um, ping, qu, whatever that is. Oh, and, and, and the guy who wrote this is, is the image Optim guy.

[00:56:09] Brett: Yep. Yep.

[00:56:10] Christina: know, this is good shit. Right. And, and so it’s like, it’s just, it’s really good. The, in, in the past, the only person I saw who could create really high quality JS was my, was my friend Andrew Zuki, who works at Gizmoto. And what he would literally do would be, he would bring in the video file into Photoshop and go frame by

[00:56:29] Brett: Oh, my God.

[00:56:30] Christina: and then like create the GIF that way.

[00:56:33] And it would look amazing and he had a whole workflow that he would do, but like now you could get probably really comparable results with GSKi. So shout out to shout out on this. Sorry, go on.

[00:56:44] Brett: have you seen GIF Fox GI F F O X there that makes surprisingly small high quality gifs of screen recordings. Like it’s specifically for screen recordings, not for converting video to G[00:57:00]

[00:57:00] Christina: Right.

[00:57:01] Brett: yeah.

[00:57:02] Christina: Yeah, J Fox is great. And also, um, the, the built in, um, kind of thing when, um, um, what is it? Um, um, clean shot, um, is really good too. Well, clean shot is just

[00:57:13] Brett: I just make, okay. That’s my pick for the week. I’m changing my pick. We’re talking about clean shot. Okay. Are you done?

[00:57:23] Christina: I’m done. Yeah.

[00:57:24] Brett: Should I go?

[00:57:25] Christina: Yeah. Please go.

[00:57:25] Brett: Okay. My pick as previously mentioned is clean shot X and it is if you need a screen capture app for Mac OS, it is the bees knees. It does everything and it does it so elegantly and for everything from capturing, uh, uh, images, windows, entire desktops, uh, annotation movies, uh, sharing.

[00:57:55] It has like a whole cloud platform built in. It does everything and it [00:58:00] just does it. Just so elegantly, like I am constantly amazed at how, how much I don’t have to think about using clean shot. Uh, it is 100% replaced any built in screenshoting tools for me. And it has surpassed any other screenshot tool I’ve ever used.

[00:58:21] Clean shot is amazing.

[00:58:24] Christina: Yeah, I, I wanna add a plus one to that. I’ve tried basically every screenshot type of utility ever, because for most of my career, regardless of what I’ve done, I’ve dealt with a lot of screenshots. Like I have a screenshot folder that I have like literally linked to, um, with default folder X that I can open it from any part of my system to the point that I have to like sync that every time I, I go on another computer, cuz I use my, my hot keys and it’s there and I used, um, what was it a, um, a cloud app for a really long time for sharing screenshots with people, but their pricing became honestly insulting.

[00:58:59] And, and so [00:59:00] I stopped using, um, cloud app and I used, um, um, what is it, uh, was it dropper or well there’s dropper and there’s another one. Um, It’s also on set up. Um, it, it’s the one that that’s, uh, this a little more Indy that you can have self hosted if you want, like on, on a, um, like an AWS server, uh, what

[00:59:18] Brett: I know what you’re talking about. I can’t remember the

[00:59:20] Christina: uh, a drop share.

[00:59:21] There we go. And in drop share, you can actually use it with, with them clean shot X, but I’ll be honest with you as much as I, I love drop share, and I love that developer and what he’s done, clean shot X just does everything. It does it really well. And it also replaced some features that remember, remember, sketch

[00:59:37] Brett: Oh

[00:59:38] Christina: and remember, remember, remember when sketch was good.

[00:59:40] Remember when sketch was good before Evernote ruined it.

[00:59:42] Brett: yes,

[00:59:43] Christina: And, and it had features like you could take a screenshot, but it automatically a padding of a, of a desktop wallpaper behind it. Right. And then you could annotate and you could do all this stuff. Clean, clean shot does all of that. And it also does, if you wanna do with your own custom URL, like a, you know, shortener, you, you can, you [01:00:00] know, use their hosted service.

[01:00:01] You could also host it yourself and have like custom landing pages, just like, um, cloud app. Like, it’s just, it’s amazing.

[01:00:07] Brett: every feature you’ve ever preferred. Another screen capture utility

[01:00:12] Christina: Yep.

[01:00:14] Brett: clean shot has

[01:00:14] Christina: Absolutely. And it’s, and it’s part of setup and the setup, um, subscribers get like, you know, like, like 10 gigabytes or something, um, of storage on their plan.

[01:00:23] Brett: the full premium plan.

[01:00:25] Christina: Yeah. I, I feel guilty because I would genuinely like to give like, and actually I might, I might figure out a way just to like give, give them more money because what they do is just so good.

[01:00:36] Sorry, I, sorry. I didn’t mean to talk over your, your, your gratitude.

[01:00:39] Brett: absolutely. That, that much appreciated. That was some valid insight.

[01:00:46] Jeff: Um, mine is beats. I already talked about it. B E E T S. So here’s the thing. This is, this speaks to me, and it also speaks to my, my worst potential for procrastination. In this [01:01:00] addition, in this like initial sentence, the purpose of beats is to get your music collection right. Once. And for all, I read that and I’m like, yeah, that’s what I want once.

[01:01:08] And for all, because I have never been super happy. I’ve always worked through iTunes honestly, and I’ve never been super happy with kind of how, um, how my iTunes libraries and the files inside of them age. And I. Love music so much and love the idea of having such like intense control over it. And this is a, um, this is a CLI that just works wonderfully.

[01:01:30] There’s a huge community around it. There are a ton of plugins. So like if you host your music from, um, from Plex or you stream from Plex, it just plugin that makes sure it lets Plex know that, you know, Hey, there’s new stuff in here. There’s a ton of like gripability in it. That is just kind of incredible.

[01:01:45] Um, you can go in and get your, your beats per minute if you need that. I mean, I don’t need it, but I want it. Um, and

[01:01:52] Brett: like to know I have it.

[01:01:53] Jeff: It’s all part of this thing. Like last week I talked about how I was using set list FM and I’ve I’ve since I think I’ve [01:02:00] now added like 220 shows or something to that. And I just like keep going.

[01:02:04] And I’ve been so pleased, um, at having a list that I can sort of, I like there’s statistics. It can tell me how many times I saw Johnny Cash perform Folsom prison, blues live, which is anytime you’ve seen him. So that’s not that exciting, but like it’s, it’s ability to sort of slice and dice the shows that you’ve seen as long as there are set list.

[01:02:24] There is so fun. And again, it’s one of those things that actually, they’re they’re little, um, memory torpedoes for me, you know, like looking at a show that I forgot and there were shows I totally forgot. I went to, but because I found a ticket stub or because I was in the neighborhood of that show as I added a different one, I remember it.

[01:02:41] And that was really sweet for me. And it’s made me want to go deep with my music collection and that’s, that’s what beats is gonna do for me. I think too bad. I get paid by the hour.

[01:02:51] Brett: Taps taps into not just the music love, but also the nostalgia of music.

[01:02:56] Jeff: Totally. Totally. So, anyway, that’s super [01:03:00] fun. That’s my gratitude. This has been fun. You guys, we had a little super techy episode from space.

[01:03:05] Brett: Yeah. I I’ve decided to title the episode dot file. Love letter.

[01:03:11] Jeff: I like it.

[01:03:11] Christina: I love that.love that. Yeah, no one would now I, now I think like if, if the whole economy and everything, wasn’t terrible, that like I could have kind of a decent startup idea, which would be like tender, but you match people with their dot files.

[01:03:30] Jeff: Ooh, that’s awesome.

[01:03:33] Brett: it. Artificial intelligence matching up people based on their, their, their

[01:03:38] Jeff: it.

[01:03:39] Brett: Unix command line preferences.

[01:03:42] Christina: I mean, honestly, look, I think you could probably tell a lot about people’s compatibility that way to be completely honest.

[01:03:47] Jeff: that’s right. That’s right. That’s.

[01:03:48] Brett: I would be really curious to see if that, if that held true, like I would be, I would be curious to see who I was matched up with based on my doubt files.

[01:03:57] Jeff: How

[01:03:58] Christina: I mean,

[01:03:58] Brett: I would like to meet that [01:04:00] person.

[01:04:00] Jeff: You could do that though. You, there are enough dot files on GitHub

[01:04:03] Christina: There are. I was gonna say, yeah, you have a whole, whole, whole things. That would be the thing too. Right. You have a ton of data that you could like mine from to do. Yeah.

[01:04:12] Brett: interesting? Like so many people duplicate their dot files. Like I’ve seen so many dot file repos that are just

[01:04:19] Jeff: Oh yeah.

[01:04:20] Brett: of someone

[01:04:21] Jeff: with no credit

[01:04:22] Brett: It would be interest to have AI go through that and see what the differences are. Where did, what modifications did you make? What personalization did you add and who might you be compatible with based on what you decided to tweak?

[01:04:38] That would be, that would be brilliant. Christina,

[01:04:40] Jeff: about, so what if, what if the, um, title is like Tilda slash.config.love, or just Tilda slash.love, then you, you, you’re getting,

[01:04:52] Brett: with it.

[01:04:53] Jeff: you’re getting closer to indicating what you’re talking about.

[01:04:56] Brett: dot. Um,

[01:04:59] Jeff: Love dot [01:05:00] YAML.

[01:05:01] Brett: just tilty slash.love. That’s gonna be that’s the episode title right

[01:05:06] Jeff: Print it.

[01:05:07] Brett: for anyone who started this episode. Wondering what the fuck that meant. This is where it came from. It all came down to this right here and you made it through the episode.

[01:05:17] And now you understand now, now you get the joke,

[01:05:19] Christina: And

[01:05:20] Jeff: But none of you, none of you bookers are in space. All right. Get, get some space sleep. You guys.

[01:05:25] Brett: get some sleep.

[01:05:26] Christina: get some sleep.