Overtired 256

[00:00:00] Brett: Welcome to Overtired. I am here with our favorite guest host, actually a Skedda, uh, Christina is a little bit out this week. So how are you Ashley?

[00:00:15] Ashley: she’s uh, she’s out playing the squid game. Christina’s playing this game?

[00:00:19] Brett: Isn’t that? That’s a, that’s a new show, right?

[00:00:22] Ashley: It is. It’s.

[00:00:23] Brett: like a lot of murder involved.

[00:00:25] Ashley: Uh, let’s call it Korean hunger games, times infinity. It’s next level. Good. You got to watch it

[00:00:34] Brett: Okay.

[00:00:35] Ashley: level. Good.

[00:00:36] Brett: Okay. I don’t think I’ll be able to talk my partner into watching that one with me, but I, uh,

[00:00:42] Ashley: Just watch it.

[00:00:43] Brett: yeah, I could find some afternoon time. You know, my busy day job gives me an hour here and there. I can squeeze in some personal TV time.

[00:00:54] Ashley: Let’s all hope. Christina comes back from squid game in one piece. That’s all I’m going to say about it. [00:01:00]

[00:01:00] Brett: She, I think she missed, I think she missed rocket this week too.

[00:01:05] Ashley: but see, I’d see squid game series.

[00:01:07] Brett: Pretty serious. Um, yeah. So how have you been at.

[00:01:12] Ashley: You know, uh, I really like coming on this show because I always like to say, I feel Overtired just all the time. So, um, this is very appropriate content for me to come and participate in. Uh, but overall good. It’s spooky season. October 1st is here, like, woo it’s October. Now. Love that big fan.

[00:01:32] Brett: Every year, every year, I plan to make some crazy, like, like combine a bunch of home automation equipment and make some really cool, like automated trick or treat thing. That’ll like give the kids a thrill and I never get around to it.

[00:01:48] Ashley: you have. So you’re an ideas, man, but like the execution, just not there.

[00:01:51] Brett: and I have a friend who owns a toy store and is excellent at like robotics. And he does like all [00:02:00] kinds of puppetry and everything. And he could, he, he, The two of us together could make some amazing stuff and I, I never pick up the

[00:02:07] Ashley: available to you, sir are infinite. This, this is I’m. I’m jealous. I got a 12 foot skeleton for Halloween. I, that was my, I have one of the home Depot, 12 foot skeletons. I was

[00:02:20] Brett: what’s that a skeleton of what kind of giant leaves? A 12 foot skeleton

[00:02:25] Ashley: I mean, I don’t really know, but does it matter? He’s just, he’s beautiful.

[00:02:30] Brett: Are we talking about Nephilim?

[00:02:31] Ashley: Yeah, sure. Why not?

[00:02:33] Brett: Did you

[00:02:34] Ashley: Maybe like a younger, giant, right?

[00:02:36] Like a, like a, like a, like a pre pubescent, giant child

[00:02:42] Brett: Did you know that biblical giants were supposedly the offspring of angels in humans.

[00:02:49] Ashley: I had. I feel like I’ve read that somewhere a long time ago.

[00:02:54] Brett: Also the dimensions given for Goliath and the Bible would be [00:03:00] physically incapable of supporting a structural skeleton. Just in case you wanted to get like

[00:03:06] Ashley: insight

[00:03:07] Brett: theological debate out of

[00:03:08] this? Well, it’s like a human skeleton can only get so large before it buckles under its own

[00:03:14] Ashley: It’s own weight. Right, right, right.

[00:03:16] Brett: And the dimensions that gave for Goliath would not have been physically possible.

[00:03:22] Ashley: Adamantium

[00:03:23] Brett: Unlike the rest of the Bible, which really stands up to scrutiny.

[00:03:27] Ashley: it really, you know what? That’s true. I will say this. Okay. Well, let me pause it a theory here. Let’s just, let’s just mix it in with pop culture. What if Goliath was a mutant? I’m just putting that up.

[00:03:40] Brett: W all right now, everything is feasible. You’ve you’ve really, uh, you’ve really tied a ball on that

[00:03:47] Ashley: If you incorporate the larger Marvel comic universe into the Bible, it totally makes sense.

[00:03:55] Brett: I just watched, okay, so here here’s how my brain works. [00:04:00] We talked about giants. Then we talked about Marvel universe. My brain went to Deadpool and then I leaped to the Hitman’s bodyguard.

[00:04:10] Ashley: The Hitman’s bodyguard. Wow. Okay. Yeah. Well, that’s a Ryan

[00:04:14] Brett: Yeah, it’s a right.

[00:04:15] Ashley: run. I got, I got,

[00:04:17] Brett: it wasn’t a super long walk. It was a bit of a walk, but I got.

[00:04:21] there. This is very different, than doing a show with just you and Christina, like

[00:04:25] Ashley: very different,

[00:04:26] Brett: You’re getting, you’re going to be other half of Overtired.

[00:04:29] Ashley: which is I like, I love it. I love doing, I like I could, I could do this all day. I’ll Cal captain American. I, I absolutely love talking to both of you. It’s the.

[00:04:37] Brett: Did you ever see the Hitman’s bodyguard?

[00:04:39] Ashley: I saw some of it, uh, like just, I think it was like on my TV. Like I wasn’t really paying attention. It seems kind of fun.

[00:04:48] Like, it seems kind of fun, but I, I

[00:04:50] Brett: It seems like it should be kind of.

[00:04:52] Ashley: I don’t have time

[00:04:54] Brett: It was not at all. Interesting.

[00:04:57] Ashley: Yeah. See, that’s the thing I have to be super [00:05:00] invested in it now because I’ve got a two-year-old. So I literally have to really, uh, pick and choose the content that I am consuming. I can’t binge watch everything now.

[00:05:11] And it’s just like, I just have to, I got to pare it down. I have to, I have to accept that I’m not going to see everything and that’s fine. Like I’m getting to that point where I’m, I’m accepting my grief. Uh, you know, the, the Kubler Ross stages of grief, I’ve finally reached acceptance on the fact that I will not see every show that has ever been made.

[00:05:34] Brett: But also do you really care?

[00:05:36] Ashley: No,

[00:05:38] Brett: Isn’t it. There’s not a lot of

[00:05:39] Ashley: I thought I

[00:05:40] Brett: it. I think he just hit a point in your life where you just don’t care anymore.

[00:05:43] Ashley: I feel like there’s about MMOs. Like everyone’s playing new world right now on. And I, I used to love MMOs. Like I said, I met my husband playing star wars galaxies, and I played tons of world of Warcraft when raffle Lich king was out. And my husband’s still like, he’ll [00:06:00] pick one game and get really into it.

[00:06:02] And like, that’s the one game he plays in. I’ve got to play everything. Like I, again, it’s like content thing. I’m like trying really hard to accept. I’m not going to get to everything, but I can at least pick and choose the things that interest me. So I might be playing, you know, I might be playing resident evil village and then I’m playing death loop and now I’m playing ratchet and clank.

[00:06:24] Then I’m playing return all like, there is a, I like to have a variety. I don’t like to just like zero in on one property and go in hard on. I like to have kind of a broad awareness of sort of the, the content landscape, whether it’s games or TV or movies.

[00:06:41] Brett: So, what are you watching?

[00:06:44] Ashley: Uh, we just started watching midnight mass last night.

[00:06:47] Brett: What is

[00:06:48] Ashley: uh, so if you are familiar with the haunting of hill house or blind manner,

[00:06:55] Brett: So, so whore. This is all.

[00:06:57] Ashley: scary, spooky, um,

[00:06:59] Brett: haven’t, haven’t [00:07:00] done horror for a while.

[00:07:01] Ashley: Thriller nourish sort of thriller kind of horror. Uh, this is a S another Mike Flanagan series. Um, and, uh, like some, some good, really good actors are in it.

[00:07:12] Raho Cooley’s in it, who was on ISO MB and he’s been another, he was Owen on blind manner. Um, he’s awesome. And.

[00:07:20] Brett: ISO combi.

[00:07:21] Ashley: Yeah. So he he’s in the show. He’s like the, the it’s about it’s really interesting. Like the first episode is sort of sets up, obviously like the world of this island, where there’s very few people that live on it and there’s already weird stuff going on, which I appreciate because it’s only seven episodes.

[00:07:39] This is like a binge, this is a very bingeable limited series. Like that’s the thing I always like about Mike Flanagan. Shows on Netflix is that they’re, they’re extremely bingeable. You, you want to get through them to like solve the mystery, unravel the mystery, find out what’s going on, get some jump scares in, you know, things like that.

[00:07:57] But, um, but it is very good. It’s [00:08:00] so far it has set up the world really well. And, um, and you know, that there’s like, There are some, you know, there’s some weird stuff going on. And then there’s a couple of inciting incidents that sort of are like, Ooh, okay. Yeah, that’s really creepy. Or, Ooh, God, that’s gross or weird.

[00:08:16] So, um, but, but very good so far. So we’re looking forward to that. I’m also watching Ted lasso,

[00:08:21] Brett: Of course.

[00:08:22] Ashley: but who isn’t watching Ted

[00:08:23] Brett: We’re G we actually were going to dedicate a segment to Ted lasso.

[00:08:27] um, in just a moment, like you’re going to be here for it. You’re going to be a part of this, but I got to tell you first along the lines of creepy and somewhat disturbing, uh, Elle and I have been watching the center. Have you seen any of the center?

[00:08:42] Ashley: I haven’t and I have seen, uh, I’ve seen references to it and also memes up from it on Twitter, in my timeline, but I don’t understand what they mean.

[00:08:53] Brett: Well, I got into it because I wanted to see what Jessica Biel was up to in season one. And it was, it was [00:09:00] excellent. Loved it. And then it’s like true detective where the next season is almost an entirely new cast, except for bill Pullman. Like all new cast, all new, uh, plot arc, everything. Uh, a reset if you will.

[00:09:15] Um, which, which I kind of, I took a break after season one and then we started season two, maybe two weeks ago and we just finished it and we’re getting ready to start season three, which I’m excited about. Cause it’s got Matt bomber from a white collar in

[00:09:32] Ashley: Oh, yeah. I love that.

[00:09:34] Brett: and Chuck, we can’t forget Chuck, but, um, but season two has this kid, Uh, played by Alicia, Henry.

[00:09:43] And he is hands down the best child actor I have seen in years, but like maybe ever he he’s portrayal of a very neurotic, uh, murder capable [00:10:00] 13 year old boy is outstanding. It’s amazing

[00:10:05] Ashley: I’m that sounds right up my alley.

[00:10:08] Brett: murder, murder, capable That I feel like that’s.

[00:10:11] Ashley: Murder capable children are very interesting to me in horror tropes. Like I, I enjoy I’m actually I’m reading, um, the book of accidents by Chuck Wendig. I just started that and there is a murder capable child in the beginning of that book. So, uh, good. That’s a nice, uh, it’s a nice it pairs.

[00:10:27] Well pairs, well,

[00:10:29] Brett: I should be taking notes here for the, uh, for the show notes. We talked about midnight mass.

[00:10:33] Ashley: midnight mass with them on Netflix.

[00:10:35] Brett: what is this book that I should check out?

[00:10:37] Ashley: It’s it is called the book of accidents. And it’s by Chuck Wendig w E N D I G.

[00:10:45] Brett: Perfect.

[00:10:46] Ashley: It’s a little, it’s a good, it’s a good, um, it’s a good Halloween read is a, so far anyway. I haven’t, I don’t know how it ends yet, but I’ve heard very good things from so many of my friends that I’m like, okay, I got it.

[00:10:58] Brett: I have friends who are into [00:11:00] horror of all kinds. And I constantly watch their recommendations because I have a curiosity about it, but I haven’t truly been like, I haven’t enjoyed being scared by a movie since like, Maybe the ring,

[00:11:18] Ashley: Yeah.

[00:11:18] Brett: but I also haven’t given it a lot of opportunities. I CA what was that super weird one with Nicholas cage,

[00:11:25] Ashley: Oh,

[00:11:26] Brett: Mandy, that one’s been on my list for a long time.

[00:11:30] Ashley: That’s a, that’s a ride. Let me tell you like maybe less horror than it is just like absolutely bonkers. Like that movie is just it’s it’s very, I mean, it’s very Nicholas cage. I don’t even know what to say about it beyond that. I like, I have found that, um, you know, how we have this sort of. Uh, so after scream came out, there was this like big push towards like horror comedy, like mixing horror and comedy, the sort of pop culture horror.

[00:11:59] And [00:12:00] then, and then we had like the som movies come out and hostel around the same time. And then we had sort of like torture porn, uh, horror movie. It feels like right now, the trend is sort of, and I think it’s sort of tapering off finally, but, um, but it feels like the trend for a long time has been, um, these sort of like.

[00:12:23] Uh, the concept of like building dread, right? So it’s like a less of that sort of like, you know, there are slasher movies out there and there are, you know, that sort of like classic horror that have, that have been released in the last few years. But it feels like when you see things like, for example, like hereditarian Midsummer, um, and, and a lot of the, kind of more recent horror, it’s like very rooted in like psychological dread where it’s just like, everything is meant to make.

[00:12:52] Super uneasy the entire movie. And it’s just like a constantly, um, [00:13:00] vibrating string on a cello, right. It’s just like a constant undertone of like dread that is going to happen. And so I, I’m really curious to see what the next sort of horror movie phase is or fad is. Um, but I really liked that type of horror.

[00:13:18] So I. I’m fully supportive of movies. Like I loved Midsummer. It was just so horrific. And, and I really like horror movies that are like very brightly colored because it always just feels so, um, unsettling that it should, this, these horrific things are happening and these like bright, beautiful places.

[00:13:40] Brett: Yeah. All right. I, yeah, I’m going to get it. I got into the center enough, so I know I’m not averse to like dark. There’s something about the suspense that like I’m stressed enough in real life,

[00:13:56] Ashley: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

[00:13:57] Brett: but then there’s a place for like [00:14:00] taking control of your anxiety to some extent.

[00:14:03] Ashley: yeah. That’s a really good point,

[00:14:05] Brett: Yeah. Anyway, uh, do you want to hear about a sponsor?

[00:14:09] Ashley: please.

[00:14:10] Brett: So I always feel bad when we have guests on making them sit through sponsors, but it’s, it’s how the show survives.

[00:14:20] Ashley: All right. You don’t have to feel bad about it at all. I think it’s wonderful that you have sponsors who who’s sponsoring Overtired.

[00:14:27] Brett: Today, uh, we’re sponsored by ritual protein because as you know, protein powders can feel intimidating with all that, no pain, no gain stuff that gets associated with them. But the truth is that deep down as in like cellular level deep, we all need protein and it’s about more than just muscles. So really.

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[00:16:58] Now just [00:17:00] putting it out there. I I’m, um, I’m eating my own dog food. It’s

[00:17:04] Ashley: That’s how that’s the best kind of indoor.

[00:17:07] Brett: Honestly. It’s the only valid kind of endorsement.

[00:17:10] Ashley: Pretty that’s pretty. That’s pretty good. That’s that’s uh, that’s very high praise.

[00:17:15] Brett: So back in like 2006, 2008, depending on like, Uh, who, whose story you, you read? Um, four Chan was the origin of something called Rick rolling. And, uh, it, it re it reluctantly. Uh, Rick Astley, reluctantly allowed it to revive his career. Uh, I should say he had started touring at about the same time and like, uh, unrelated. but he, he eventually accepted that this, this meme, the site. Okay. For anyone who doesn’t know, it’s basically when you click a link that you think is going to go one place and instead [00:18:00] it goes to never going to give you up by Rick Astley.

[00:18:03] Ashley: Yeah, pretty simple.

[00:18:05] Brett: it is, and it is, I think it may be like the, the meme with the longest life.

[00:18:15] Ashley: I think you might be right. This is like, I mean, it’s, I don’t, I can’t think of anything that has lasted this long, at least in the way of like linking to a video or like just in the cause. Like, I mean, there are memes that like, we still see from a long time ago, but it’s not the same.

[00:18:34] Brett: right. Yeah, no,

[00:18:35] Ashley: still very much in the forefront of like pop culture.

[00:18:40] Like it’s, it’s a, it’s still a weirdly T relevant meme. Like it, it, it has not, there was a time where it felt a little stale and it kind of went away for a minute and then somebody brought it back and it was like, oh yeah, everybody really likes this. And it’s dumb and funny.

[00:18:55] Brett: I, I got to a point where you can just say the word, Rick roll [00:19:00] to me, and the song gets stuck in my head. I get like, Metta, Metta.

[00:19:04] Ashley: I immediately hear the beat.

[00:19:06] Brett: Yeah.

[00:19:07] So this, this over the last 15 years, like this has just been kind of a constant undercurrent on the internet. And then last week’s Ted lasso came out and I feel like it all came to a climax in a funeral scene where the main what’s Her name?

[00:19:30] Um, Rebecca. Rebecca, Rick rolls a funeral

[00:19:37] Ashley: Her dad’s funeral.

[00:19:39] Brett: amazing,

[00:19:40] Ashley: It’s pretty incredible. And she doesn’t do it on purpose. Like there’s a story. Well, like there’s a story behind why she sings that, like she’s not just coming in to throw a chaos bomb into the funeral proceedings. Like they give her a good character, backstory reason to sing that song at a funeral, but it [00:20:00] is pretty hilarious.

[00:20:02] Um, and, uh, my, I think my favorite. Thing that I saw after that episode went live was, um, it, I think it was Rick, Rick Astley himself, uh, ended up tweeting to Hannah wadding, M um, and said, where is it? Uh, literally like put up this one minute long video. Cause he, I guess didn’t know like how. The song was going to be used or in what context, like, I think, you know, they just licensed it.

[00:20:35] Right. And so they don’t necessarily go directly to the artists for that. They would just go to your, you know, your label. And so he posted this video. It’s like a minute long. It’s honest. And he’s just like blown away at how it was used. He just loved it. He’s like, you know, very complimentary, all this stuff is just, it’s really cute.

[00:20:53] Um, just so, just so lovely and pure, just like everything else that Ted lasso was [00:21:00] doing. Um, And it’s just, it’s so nice. And, uh, and she is, she she’s totally flips out, um, Hannah wadding him, um, which is just so funny to me, like, she’s just like, oh my God. Like for gasoline, I love this is so great. Um, so yeah, it’s, it’s absolutely fantastic.

[00:21:20] And the way that they sort of incorporate into the show, it’s, it’s really lovely. Like Ted lasso is the kind of show where I watch it and I’m just. You know that moment in Ratatouille where Anton ego takes a bite of the Ratatouille later, like begrudgingly is like eating it up because he’s so furious that it’s so good.

[00:21:41] Brett: Um, I’m going to admit, I’ve never seen Ratatouille, but I, I can. I can, I can, uh, I can envision this.

[00:21:47] Ashley: Yeah, but that is how I feel. Every time I should have last time, I was just like begrudgingly watching it with so much joy because there I’m just like, oh, these writers, like these. These bastards, like, they’re so good at this. Like, [00:22:00] I I’m, I’m angry at how talented I’m insulted at how talented these people are.

[00:22:04] It’s offensive. Like, I I’m, it’s so weird. It’s like that feeling where you’re just like, it’s not jealousy. You’re just like, oh, this is so good. Like I’m, I’m furious at how good this is.

[00:22:14] Brett: Yes that I can totally relate to. It is.

[00:22:17] I mean, I watch a lot of TV. I consider myself a pretty good judge of, of writing and production and set design and acting like I’ve. I’ve seen enough to, to know what’s good. And Ted lasso constantly stands head and shoulders above some of the best TV.

[00:22:40] Ashley: Yeah, it’s really good.

[00:22:43] Brett: Outstanding. Yeah. Ha have you listened to much other stuff from Rick Astley?

[00:22:49] Ashley: Uh, no, not particularly like, I I’m sure I’ve heard other stuff.

[00:22:54] Brett: I’m not even sure I have. I, all I know is people keep telling me, oh, he’s really a very talented [00:23:00] musician. You should hear his other stuff. And I just haven’t gotten around to actually following up on that yet.

[00:23:05] Ashley: I haven’t either. I don’t have a lot of like, so, so the kid is like really into records, like. I’m not complaining my child. My child is two and a half years old almost. And he literally loves vinyl records on a record player. He will not, he gets mad when I try to play the exact same albums on our Sonos.

[00:23:28] No. Well, if he wants the record player,

[00:23:31] Brett: What a snob.

[00:23:33] Ashley: he’s such a little snob

[00:23:36] Brett: When I

[00:23:37] Ashley: but too, but, but the good news is, is they don’t really make a lot of. Kids toddler like baby shark stuff

[00:23:45] Brett: sure.

[00:23:46] Ashley: So all he listens to is like he, this kid will specifically ask by name for. Musicians like the black Pumas. And he wants sabotage by the Beastie boys.

[00:23:59] He [00:24:00] wants, you know, JD MacPherson, like he wants a Dolly Parton. He says, play islands in the stream. And I’m just like, okay, like, sure. Yeah, no problem. But it’s like, like I, this is my whole music listening life right now because like he gets into these. He gets into these routines where he wants to hear a song over and over and over again until he’s over it.

[00:24:25] And so right now it’s like, there’s like four songs. It’s like sabotage by the Beastie boys, which look no complaining about that. Uh, but the four songs that are in my rotation right now are sabotaged by the Beastie boys. Let the good times roll by JD MacPherson, uh, nine to five by Dolly Parton and monkey wrench by the foo fighters.

[00:24:44] Brett: That’s not a bad lineup. Like

[00:24:46] Ashley: Pretty good lineup. He has good taste, actually. I’m impressed

[00:24:50] Brett: When I was a kid.

[00:24:51] Ashley: teaching him. Well,

[00:24:51] Brett: had a play school record player, like a suitcase record player.

[00:24:56] Ashley: that. He has that little Fisher price

[00:24:58] Brett: Yeah, maybe that’s what it

[00:24:59] Ashley: [00:25:00] one. that’s a suitcase. That’s a real record player, but

[00:25:02] Brett: Well, this one could only play seven inches.

[00:25:05] Ashley: yeah. See, those ones are like the classic they’re real. They plug in. They like, they play seven inch vinyl. Like he has the one that’s like the one for toddlers where it’s like little plastic records that play like, uh, like almost like music box songs.

[00:25:20] And it comes with five little plastic records and he loves that thing.

[00:25:24] Brett: No, like

[00:25:24] Ashley: it with him every.

[00:25:25] Brett: for me, and I’m, I’m older than you. So you, you may or may not remember, but there was a time when, uh, magazines and even cereal boxes would have flimsy vinyl, uh, pages that you could cut a record out of and play it on a seven inch record player.

[00:25:45] Ashley: Oh, my God really.

[00:25:47] Brett: Yeah. And like, cause I mean, they would be the thickness of just like a, a heavier magazine page.

[00:25:55] Uh, just, just vinyl.

[00:25:57] Ashley: I’ve never heard of such a.

[00:25:58] Brett: Yeah.

[00:25:59] And you could [00:26:00] like, you could get your favorite single as the back page of a magazine. And a, and that was my, we weren’t allowed to listen to rock and roll in my house, but I had, I had the Muppet babies, rocket to the moon was my first rock and roll record. And from the second I heard that four, four.

[00:26:22] Ashley: Yeah.

[00:26:23] Brett: I was, I was in and I never, I never stopped listening to rock and roll after that. But the Muppet babies on a seven inch record on a play school record player, that’s like, that’s how I got into music.

[00:26:37] Ashley: Wow. That’s amazing. Okay. So when I was a kid, it was cassette tapes. So I had this thing and I have looked for this thing and I don’t even know I’ve looked for what it’s called. I can’t find it anywhere. I used to have this thing that looked like a walk. Sort of, but it played singles on miniature cassette [00:27:00] tapes, like miniature cassette tapes.

[00:27:03] And it, and I remember having Debbie Gibson and one side was shake your love. And the other side was, oh my God, whatever the other hit that she had on that shake your love album. Yeah. Something like that. It was like, One of those songs. And so is on the same album, but it was like the two singles from that album was one side and the other.

[00:27:27] And then I think the other one I had was new kids on the block. It was like the right stuff and hanging tough. Like those are the two that I had and I was like, obsessed with that little cassette tape thing. Every time we went to toys R us, I would immediately go to that aisle where that thing was. And I would look and see if there were new cassettes.

[00:27:48] But like, that was like the thing that I remember specifically, like, I, I loved that thing so much when I was a kid, I was probably probably like eight. I was five, like eight ish, like right in there, [00:28:00] like probably seven, seven to nine, between seven and nine. And it just like, it was my favorite thing. I loved it so much.

[00:28:06] And, um, and my mom was really into like pop music. So I was listening to like, when I was a kid, it was like a lot of Madonna, like all the top 40 stuff in like the eighties.

[00:28:16] Brett: My mom was into Elvis and Peter Paul and Mary, and my dad only listen to classical music. Everything else was too new.

[00:28:27] Ashley: Yeah. See, I was around my grandparents a lot cause we lived on their property and so it was like, my mom was really into pop music. My grandpa was really into Elvis, so we, I got a lot big Elvis, a big Elvis fan. And then, um, and then also listen to like a ton of like, sort of. I guess now you would kind of refer to it as it wasn’t like seventies yacht rock.

[00:28:50] It was like that eighties sort of yacht rock, whereas like Linda Ronstadt and like car, like a Richard Marx, um, that sort of [00:29:00] like, uh, Gloria Estefan, like, you know, that sort of like wheelhouse or is like, sort of for older contemporary, like. contemporary of the eighties. Like I listened to a lot of that on the radio.

[00:29:13] So, but, um, but yeah, that was like a lot of, uh, and then I listened to a lot of, um, my grandpa’s Spanish. So I listened to a lot of mariachi music and like cumbia music, which was.

[00:29:25] Brett: enjoy some mariachi.

[00:29:26] Ashley: I still love it. There’s a band called mariachi L Bronx, which is the mariachi version of El Bronx. Um, and they have an album. I believe it’s two.

[00:29:37] The name of album is too. And it’s, um, or maybe it’s three cause they just, they just number them. Uh, but it’s, it has the, the opening track of that album is 48 roses. And I can only describe it as mariachi music meets sublime. And it’s literally one of the best that album slapped so hard. [00:30:00] I can’t recommend enough.

[00:30:01] It’s so good.

[00:30:02] Brett: You want to know what TV show is blowing me away with soundtrack right now? Sex education.

[00:30:09] Ashley: tell me about this show because I okay. Again, a show that I have seen many people talk about in my timeline, but I have not gotten to it yet. What is the show about.

[00:30:19] Brett: So it’s, it’s a story about schoolers in England, uh, and kind of their. Uh, it’s about learning about sex. It’s about puberty. It’s about, um, uh, adventures and misadventures in and sexuality and Scully from the X-Files Gillian Anderson. Uh, like a mother who is also a, a sex expert, a sex Burch, if you will. Um, and like she’s raising a boy who is very awkward, but in the first season he becomes like the school’s sex [00:31:00] advice guru, uh, cause he grew up around.

[00:31:04] You know, very smart, uh, sex, sex messaging. And, uh, he’s able to turn a very Scholastic, completely lacking and worldly experience, but a very Scholastic, uh, understanding of sex and sexuality and all of the problems that teenagers are going through. And he likes, sets up shop in a. Uh, in and out, uh, uh, lavatory, like, uh, it’s uh, the whole building is just like showers and toilets and it’s abandoned and he sets up and he sits in one stall and people come in and sit in the other stall and do like a confessional style.

[00:31:41] Like here’s the sex problem I’m having. And he, and he does a great job and he solves a bunch of problems and that season one, and now we’re on season two or season three. I’ve lost track. Oh. Like, but the current season is. As, as always, soundtrack is amazing. The characters are amazing. [00:32:00] It’s it’s really, it’s fun.

[00:32:03] Ashley: That’s that is a very Hardy endorsement. And so I’m going to have to add that to my watch list.

[00:32:09] Brett: Uh, did you see big mouth?

[00:32:12] Ashley: I’ve seen someone.

[00:32:13] Brett: it’s like a lot less crude version. It tackles the same kind of topics that big mouth tackles, but it does it in a lot more dignified way. I love big mouth. Don’t get me wrong. I thought that Joe

[00:32:25] Ashley: specific show for a specific

[00:32:27] Brett: Yeah.

[00:32:28] Ashley: Yeah, I, this is that’s actually, that is actually to me, probably the most helpful description of that show. Like very helpful.

[00:32:36] Brett: Wow. You’re

[00:32:37] Ashley: That’s the elevator pitch that I needed to say. Okay. You son of a bitch, I’m in.

[00:32:43] Brett: So before we, Uh, before we wrap up today, do you want to talk a little bit about what Amazon is up to schemes and plans?

[00:32:52] Ashley: you know, all they want to do is just put a little cop robot in your house. That’s oh man. Okay. [00:33:00] So Amazon earlier this week had its, um, I guess like a new product showcase. They do that. About once a year. And most of it was a lot of, you know, Hey, we’re making new ring products, we’re upgrading this, this thing that you have, we’re doing a bigger echo show.

[00:33:16] It’s 15 inches. Like there’s a whole bunch of host of kind of Amazon related products that they have upgraded. Um, and they talk about two products in particular that really sort of. We’re the talk of the intro, the tech internet this week, uh, which the first one is they gave an update on their home security drone, which is a flying surveillance, drone that lives in your house.

[00:33:43] Like think of it as a Roomba of the sky,

[00:33:47] Brett: a ring doorbell come to life.

[00:33:49] Ashley: a ring doorbell with wings, a wing doorbell. That’s what they should’ve called.

[00:33:55] Brett: It was right there. It was right in front of

[00:33:58] Ashley: there the whole [00:34:00] time

[00:34:03] Brett: Oh,

[00:34:03] Ashley: at Amazon where somebody cut me a check because that is okay. I’m going to send an email to Jeff Bezos. Um, so yeah, they basically, oh, we’re just going to call it a wing. We’re gonna call it a. That’s what we’re going to do. So here’s a wing drone. That’s what it is. So, uh, this thing is, uh, it lives in a little container and then you can sort of, uh, it’s designed to sort of like show you your house.

[00:34:33] Uh, but with just one camera. So basically the Amazon is trying to say, this is the only camera you’ll need in your house. It can fly all the way around and check everything out and then come back and then dock itself, like that’s the goal. So instead of buying. Eight cameras for eight different rooms or sections of your house and checking in on each of them individually, you can like have this home camera fly and record a little [00:35:00] video of, you know, take a little flight through the house, record video, and send it back to you.

[00:35:05] So, uh, it can, it can tie into, um, a ring alarm home security system. So if like you have. Part, if you have a sensor on your door and that’s activated while you’re out, the, the camera, we’ll go fly over there to see what’s going on. Like it’ll go investigate, uh, you know, strange occurrence with the, if the sensor is triggered.

[00:35:29] Um, it’s very interesting.

[00:35:32] Brett: It Feels like. Little scene right there, like motion at the door, something flies over to see what’s up. It feels very black mirror. To me.

[00:35:40] Ashley: Feels very dystopian. Doesn’t it. It’s.

[00:35:42] Brett: does.

[00:35:43] Ashley: We’re about to get more dystopian because not only do they have a flying autonomous flying surveillance, drone for your house, which that sounds dystopian enough, uh, they also then announced Astro named after the Jetson’s dog, which was not a robot. Rosie was the. [00:36:00] I will go to my grave, feeling begrudge, feeling injured about this is this is a grievous Lander on Rosie, the robot.

[00:36:08] Uh, but they released this little robot Astro. It’s a rolling surveillance robot designed to track behavior of people in your house and perform helper duties and other surveillance. So it’s supposed to be. Like the drone that flies around, except it’s actually just rolling around your house all the time and like checking in with you.

[00:36:32] So imagine this little cute looking little rolling robot on wheels. It’s like a screen with wheels and it goes, hello. Uh, here you have a new message and it like plays you a voicemail or whatever.

[00:36:44] Brett: noticed your pleasure on yourself. Would you like. Would you like some pornography?

[00:36:48] Ashley: Hello. Uh, sir, I can play you some, uh, so I can play you some PornHub if you’re so inclined. I see that you’re busy.

[00:36:57] Um, I see that you’re nude. Would you like to watch [00:37:00] some pornography? Uh, it’s just so bad. It’s very weird. Um, so it’s a century, it’s a, there’s like extra add-ons you can add to it. That’s like a cup holder, so it can like bring you a drink or someone can put a drink in it and then it can take it to somebody else.

[00:37:15] Uh, and then they have like an automatic dog treat dispenser.

[00:37:20] Brett: Oh, I could see it. I could see a place for that.

[00:37:23] Ashley: yeah. And

[00:37:23] Brett: you can buy an automatic dog trading, a dispatcher. You don’t need to put an Amazon robot in your home.

[00:37:28] Ashley: Right. And will, and here’s the, here’s the interesting thing. So. We seen it got a little confirmation from Amazon that apparently it, it maps out your house. Cause it has to know what to avoid.

[00:37:41] Right. And it uploads the map of your home to Amazon servers. Like Amazon needs to have that information for computational like awareness and improvements. And so that doesn’t make me feel great. Like, I don’t love that, that it’s not just on device. Like I it’s. [00:38:00] It’s such a difficult thing, right? It’s like, how much of your privacy are you willing to give up in exchange for the convenience of a better virtual assistant, a cloud basis system?

[00:38:13] Right. So we talk about this all the time. Like that’s why Sirius so bad or, or is the least efficient of all of the voice assistance because that data. There’s PR there are some privacy gates on, on what Siri’s doing that, for example, or by comparison, Google and Amazon do not have. And so it actually, the more data that you’re feeding a system like Alexa, or okay.

[00:38:42] Google. Sorry. If I triggered anybody’s, uh, devices, I apologize. Um, stop. So if you’re, but if you trigger those things like, and you’re talking to them and you’re giving them just like massive amounts of computational data, it gets. It does get better at it. That’s how it learns. But the problem [00:39:00] is, is you’re also giving up some privacy there.

[00:39:01] So it’s a trade. And so it’s that, that is sort of the same thing here. Uh, but I think the one thing in particular that made me laugh really hard about this is so it’s a thousand dollars sort of this thing. Amazon says it’s going to ship later this year. Cool. Uh, but. It’s they ask you a bunch of questions when you go to pre-order it they’re like, do you have a house with two floors?

[00:39:27] Like, do you have a house with stairs? Do you have, uh, do you have transitions on your flooring? Like carpet to hardwood, tile to carpet, like whatever, uh, they ask you questions like that. Do you have any floor to ceiling windows in your home?

[00:39:43] Brett: Are they suicidal?

[00:39:44] Ashley: Well, it’s funny that you should ask that question because vice published an article with some insider information and it has this meeting document, uh, and I’m just going to read this.

[00:39:59] I’m [00:40:00] just, I’m just going to read this little, this little bit here. It says one of the internal documentation files presented in a development meeting obtained by motherboard describes how Astro patrols and owner’s home and tries to identify people at encounters. Okay. The meeting document spells out the process in a much blunter way than Amazon’s cutesy marketing suggests, uh, it slowly and intelligently patrols the home when unfamiliar people are already.

[00:40:29] It moves to a predetermined scan point. And if the robot detects something, it thinks is out of the ordinary, it will investigate further. But the problem is, is that apparently, um, this thing, uh, does not work well. Developers who worked on Astro say the versions of the robot, they worked on. We’re not great.

[00:40:54] And this is a quote from a source who worked on the project. Astro is terrible and will [00:41:00] almost certainly throw itself down a flight of stairs if presented the opportunity.

[00:41:03] Brett: Okay.

[00:41:04] Ashley: The person detection is unreliable at best making the in-home security proposition laughable. It feels fragile for something with such an absurd cost, by the way, it has a, um, a mast that looks like a selfie stick that comes out from the robot.

[00:41:19] Cause it’s short, it’s like a little short robot and it has to be able to see kind of at like, like four feet tall. And so it has a little master that extends up so that I can like record stuff. It is wild.

[00:41:33] Brett: And it can get stuck according to the people who worked on it. And when it’s stuck in its extended position, it’s almost impossible to ship it back to Amazon.

[00:41:43] Ashley: Yes.

[00:41:43] Brett: makes itself unreturnable.

[00:41:46] Ashley: Yeah, it makes itself on returnable. It breaks. Amazon’s trying to position this as like, oh yeah, you could have it in your elderly relatives house and it can check on them, be a help or drown. And I’m like,

[00:41:56] Brett: the single story, elderly person’s home.

[00:41:59] Ashley: Yeah, in a [00:42:00] single-story elderly person’s home, which by the way, you would have to go to bed every night and pray to whatever God it is that you’re interested in, that your elderly relative does not trip over the rolling robot in your house, in their house and break a hip.

[00:42:17] Brett: Yeah, that would be the, the thousand dollar robot would be the least of your concerns at that point.

[00:42:22] Ashley: I mean, it’s just

[00:42:24] Brett: Well,

[00:42:24] Ashley: so silly.

[00:42:25] Brett: and that’s all skirting around The privacy issues. Like.

[00:42:29] Ashley: The fact that Amazon does it, that there’s a lot of questionable and sort of secretive practices that Amazon has been criticized for that involve selling ring, video, doorbell footage to police. Like they, I mean, this is not great, you know, like what happens when. The police decide, uh, your, your house just looks suspicious.

[00:42:55] Or if you’re a person of color, if you’re black indigenous a person of [00:43:00] color, like what happens when some racist cop or racist neighbor who doesn’t know, you sees you walking into your home assumes it’s not yours because of their, because of their SIS, you know,

[00:43:12] Brett: that never happens.

[00:43:13] Ashley: hit that never happens. And, and then calls the police and they say, okay, well we need to pull this.

[00:43:18] And then they go to the. And they pull your video footage out of your house. Like this just such a real moral gray area here. Like, I don’t love it. Like, I I’m all about having a drone deliver me a pizza, like outside of my lawn, but like, I can’t, I can’t get behind, like, we’ve been. Kind of going out of our way to buy products, uh, for surveillance purposes that are not connected to the internet.

[00:43:47] So like, um, you fee is like probably my favorite company for this. We have our baby monitors. You. Um, the space for you, baby monitor. It does not. It it’s a dumb baby monitor. It doesn’t connect to the internet. [00:44:00] It doesn’t need to, it’s just a signal. And like, uh, and then we’re probably going to do the security cameras, which are like, you know, again, just records right on device battery lasts for 180 days.

[00:44:13] And that’s it, it just, it auto records over stuff after seven days,

[00:44:18] Brett: Yeah. Like I w I want, I want to get some IP, uh, like I want connect. I want to connect to my Synology without having to go outside of the home for that kind of surveillance, um, that I could do. But yeah, I, I have, I have echoes in my house and like I find them very handy. Being able to set multiple timers in the kitchen while I’m cooking.

[00:44:43] It’s very disconcerting when they. When they come on unprovoked and say, I’m sorry, I didn’t get that.

[00:44:50] And it makes you very aware of what it is they are getting. Yeah.

[00:44:56] Ashley: Yeah. Well, and it’s like, I just, like, I don’t know [00:45:00] about anybody else, but like I do not have a full like day outfit on when I walk around in my house.

[00:45:06] Brett: I do. I do not have anything with video in mind.

[00:45:10] Ashley: Yeah. Like sometimes I walk around in my underwear sometimes I’m like, sometimes our dogs are barking and I have to go like shush stab of the yard. And I made my pajamas. Like I just, I don’t like, I just don’t. I don’t know, man. I don’t know. I don’t know. I get, I get really weirded out by this stuff and I should love it because I love technology and everything, but it’s just.

[00:45:31] Brett: There’s been a line like it used to be, you could have this, uh, almost naive love of all new technology and only the truly paranoid were concerned, but we’ve rounded up. We’ve rounded a corner

[00:45:46] Ashley: he’s really rounded a

[00:45:47] Brett: Decade 10, 15 years, like things have gotten all new technology is built around, uh, invasion of privacy.

[00:45:55] It’s like, it’s a core business model now.

[00:45:58] Ashley: Yeah. And it’s [00:46:00] that’s my problem is it’s like, we’ve, like you said, we’ve turned a corner where, you know, your privacy is the product. And it’s like, yes, I understand some people who say like, well, if you’re not doing anything illegal, you shouldn’t, you have nothing to worry about. But like, that’s not really the point.

[00:46:16] Right.

[00:46:17] Brett: It really isn’t.

[00:46:18] Ashley: Yeah, that’s true. But like, but yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s not the point. And so. I very much have like care a lot about this now. And I feel like we sort of are trying to put the genie back in the bottle because of products like Gmail is like the biggest one, right? That’s like the one product that you can point to and say, like, this was the beginning of that business model is like, we’ll give you this thing for free.

[00:46:43] Cause I remember, do you remember when Photoshop was $600 every year?

[00:46:48] Brett: Yup.

[00:46:49] Ashley: And it’s like, now it’s like, we’re, we’re going to give you this thing for free, but you’re going to give us all your, all your privacy. And it’s like, well, I don’t love that anymore. Like, let me give you a couple of bucks. [00:47:00] Like, let me pay for a subscription wherever, as long as you’re not like overly overreaching on my data or at least give me the option to choose what you take.

[00:47:08] Brett: yeah, yeah. For sure.

[00:47:10] Ashley: Show me a bingo board and be like, okay, we’d like to collect all of this data. But if you pay for a subscription, you get to pick five buckets like that. We’ll take from you and all the rest of them. You keep to yourself, like, let me just, let me just at least have some level of customization over what I’m giving you.

[00:47:29] Brett: Did you.

[00:47:29] hear about this problem? That, uh, shit, what’s it called? Not, not, uh, not Instagram. W tic-tac tic-tac was having w w when they tried to crack down on COVID misinformation, their algorithm was so good that if someone watched one, uh, video containing COVID misinformation, it would queue up like auto-play all of the possible misinformation you could fit [00:48:00] into one playlist. Self-defeating.

[00:48:04] Ashley: I really, I mean, God.

[00:48:07] Brett: they tried to fix it, but they have this thing where you can take the audio from one clip and apply it to another clip. So the clips they deleted were on average, getting used, the audio would be used in over a hundred other clips that there was no way to stop it.

[00:48:23] Ashley: Yeah. It’s like stemming. I mean, is it? Yeah, no, no, you can’t stop that. Did you ever, did you ever hear, there was a Twitter thread years ago that like really has stuck with me. Tech and like computer sciences and things like that, which is, um, and I, I feel like a jerk because I don’t remember his name.

[00:48:44] Oh, it’s a guy who was talking about how he’s like I used to be in, I think he was either in physics or chemistry and compute and comp size. So he’s in computer sciences and he talks about how the computer [00:49:00] science industry. So I’m. For all intents and purposes has never had an ethical reckoning the way that other sciences have.

[00:49:10] So he talks about how in the. In the chemistry community, they had to reckon with a chemical warfare and they had to reckon with the ethics of creating that and also, um, you know, dynamite and, uh, you know, other there’s other like other examples. And then he talks about how like, chemical warfare was the big one for the chemistry.

[00:49:33] And she’s like, and then in the physics space, we had to grapple with the

[00:49:39] Brett: Adam bomb.

[00:49:40] Ashley: the ethical nature of the. And also the hydrogen bomb, right? So like now the Hydra bomb and he’s like in really computer science has never experienced that. They’ve never experienced a watershed moment of reckoning and the closest we got to, it was maybe Cambridge Analytica [00:50:00] and like, but it’s so it’s so disjointed and so separate that it’s very hard to have those watershed moments now because there’s not a collective experience that occurred.

[00:50:13] Under any of these sort of, uh, you know, scandals. So a good example is this week, uh, Facebook released this, this massive set of slides that it had done research on like deep research, really deep research on the effect of Instagram, on teenage girls in a very negative way like this, this app is hurting them.

[00:50:36] It is harming them in a way that. We don’t even realize how bad it is and Facebook knows, and they don’t care. Like they just do not seem to care because it, they, it doesn’t matter to them. And, you know, and it’s like, these moments are really. Th the, the industry is just in need of this reckoning moment where we are [00:51:00] teaching.

[00:51:00] Cause now if you go to school to be a physicist, if you go to school to be a chemist, there are classes about ethics that you learn and you learn about those watershed moments and you, you understand what. The power of your chosen field can be used to do, you know, can be done with what that power can be used for in the worst ways.

[00:51:27] In the worst hand. As opposed to only saying, well, it’s just going to change everybody’s life for the better, because it’s connecting people like Facebook never considers the ramifications of what if this thing that we’re building this piece of product that we’re building is used in the worst possible way.

[00:51:44] Like, what is the worst possible scenario? And I’m, and that’s why they have such a hard time getting a handle on disinformation because they never, because they never said we need to build this product to protect from that thing in the first place. [00:52:00] And like so much tech does this where it’s like, they only think of the best case scenario, the, the, the positive change it’ll bring to the world without actually considering how it can be weaponized by people with less altruistic intent.

[00:52:14] And it was just such a good thread. And I, I think about it all the time.

[00:52:18] Brett: It’s like they, they can at the outset that consider what, what all the good things are going to happen and they ignore the potential for bad things. But then when the bad things do happen, as they inevitably will, as things scale, they continue to like actively. Actively hide them, work around them. Like it is the profit motive kind of kills all benevolence of technology.

[00:52:51] Ashley: And also the investor, the investment pipeline does because these companies are not going to admit to any potential [00:53:00] investor, that there are certain ways of using, uh, a service or a product that can really harm people, because then they’re not going to get invested in.

[00:53:09] Brett: Except for some of those ways or some of that, some of that in.

[00:53:12] and of itself is profitable. Like there there’s, there’s profit to be made on the dark side of these technologies.

[00:53:18] Ashley: Absolutely. And Instagram, I mean, you know, like, uh, they had these hearings the other day and, um, Senator Blumenthal got like scorched for talking about like, what is a Finsta? Like whatever, but he explained it like an hour prior. He knows exactly what it is. And then he asked the executive, he was like, w do, do you have plans to end Finstas, which are fake Instagrams, that a lot of kids will set up for, uh, to keep away from their parents, to like share things with their friends and stuff like that.

[00:53:49] And it’s, it goes beyond that, but that’s a, that’s a big chunk of users who have a, a second Instagram account. And really at the end of the day, Instagram would never stop.

[00:53:59] Brett: No, They push [00:54:00] those on. You Like every time I log in, they’re like, Hey, do you want to make a second

[00:54:04] Ashley: another account. Yeah, because that’s more accounts that they can say are active and it makes their bottom line better, makes it easier and makes them more money to sell ads.

[00:54:14] And it’s just like, of course, they’re not going to stop that. Like they’re never going to stop that. You know, they have a whole slide deck that says how harmful Instagram is for teenage girls and they’ve done nothing. To, you know, they’ve done absolutely nothing to curb that

[00:54:33] Brett: this guy, dark.

[00:54:34] Ashley: it did it, it really did, but

[00:54:36] Brett: an episode that really focused so hard on Rick rolling

[00:54:41] Ashley: We went from Rick rolling to what I argue is one of the biggest technological, uh, fights worth having in the 21st century, privacy,

[00:54:50] Brett: it’s worth it. Conversation

[00:54:52] Ashley: privacy. Yeah. Yeah. It’s it’s, it’s I like, I think about that thread all the time, and I’m just like, just, just think [00:55:00] about how you can, you know, it’s like, if you have a brick, you can build a house, but you can also kill somebody with it.

[00:55:05] You know, it’s just think about that. Like really think about it before you’re going out there being like, this is only going to build beautiful houses. It will never be used

[00:55:15] Brett: bricks for everyone.

[00:55:16] Ashley: for everybody gets bricks. In fact, take a whole bag full of.

[00:55:21] Brett: Just sign over some personal data on the way.

[00:55:23] Ashley: You have a cell. Yeah, exactly. Give us your social security number.

[00:55:27] Brett: Ashley. It’s always a pleasure to have you on.

[00:55:30] Ashley: I love you guys, both. I love you both equally. I like hanging out with you anchor six different types of conversation, but equally.

[00:55:39] Brett: It is. And, and when Christina and I are together, we play off each other quite well. And I feel like it comes out pretty balanced. Uh, when it’s just you and Christina, it gets very bachelor heavy.

[00:55:52] Ashley: And can we, well, we, it gets chaotic, right? Like we’re, we’re just a couple of hurricanes rolling around. Like,

[00:55:59] Brett: [00:56:00] Yeah, you both talk faster than I do too.

[00:56:03] Ashley: it’s true. And just imagine two hurricanes colliding, like that’s basically what hanging out with me. And Christina was like,

[00:56:09] Brett: Well, except you would think like with a certain amount of light, uh, w w hurricanes will say metaphorically colliding that there would be like,

[00:56:17] a neutrality that came out of that, like, uh, an eye of the storm. I feel like you guys hit that last time. I listened to you guys do an episode. Sometimes I just edit episodes and I don’t pay attention.

[00:56:33] Ashley: That’s fair.

[00:56:34] Brett: last time I forgot to put the, the, the closing, uh, the outro music on the episode. I’m sorry to everyone who found that very disconcerting to just be just left, hanging, just

[00:56:45] Ashley: It was a cliffhanger. We just put together a cliffhanger episode. It’s fine.

[00:56:48] Brett: Do you know how we end this up? These shows? Do you know how we ended up episode? I say, get some sleep, Christina and Christina said, Get some sleep, Brett.

[00:56:58] So you want to try it? [00:57:00]

[00:57:00] Ashley: Yeah, let’s do it.

[00:57:01] Brett: This is, this is how the Overtired show goes. Get some sleep, actually.

[00:57:05] Ashley: Get some sleep, Brett.