Overtired 277

[00:00:00] Christina: You’re listening to overtired. I’m Christina Warren joined as always by Brett Terpstra and Jeff Severns Guntzel. Gentlemen, how are you?

[00:00:14] Brett: perfect.

[00:00:15] Jeff: So good.

[00:00:18] Christina: Tired.

[00:00:18] Brett: you want to know Why?

[00:00:20] Christina: Why?

[00:00:21] Brett: I got my Vyvanse?

[00:00:22] Jeff: Woo.

[00:00:24] Brett: I, I called in a couple days early just to make sure that it would actually work out this time. And instead of setting the refill date to be like exactly when I was going to run out of Focalin, she just went ahead and made it available on Friday, actually on Thursday, but I didn’t pick it up until Friday and I didn’t start it until this morning.

[00:00:46] We’re recording on Saturday. So this is my first day back on Vyvanse after weeks of no stimulants and a year since I’ve been on Vyvanse and I’m really happy it’s it’s treating me well.

[00:00:59] Christina: I’m so [00:01:00] happy for you. Cause that was rough for you. Like not having anything. Having to go through the stimulant withdrawal and having to go off of like the Focalin, which you enjoy. And I’m also dealing with the, you know, like the, I guess the fact that the focal ended increase the manic episodes.

[00:01:18] Brett: The thing Focalin really gives you a jolt of dopamine. And I had really come to rely on, uh, having a lot of dopamine and then going without any stimulants, you have this glut of dopamine and it is, it leads to some pretty bad depression. Like there’s not, I don’t have like stimulant withdrawal, like they’re out of my system in 24 hours.

[00:01:45] And there’s no like physiological, uh, issues with just going off stimulants, but the depression that’ll get you.

[00:01:57] Jeff: Do you have to dial in the dosage or do you know [00:02:00] from previously using at

[00:02:01] Brett: W we went right back to the dosage I was on when I had originally switched away from Vyvanse. And I had gone through like a couple of other like Conserta and stuff like that. But, uh, even at I’m at 60 milligrams, which I’m pretty sure is the max dose,

[00:02:18] Jeff: Yeah.

[00:02:18] Brett: at 60, like Vyvanse just isn’t that effective for me.

[00:02:22] It is it’s the mildest of all the stimulants I’ve ever been on. So doing any less than 60 seemed kind of feudal

[00:02:31] Jeff: Oh man. It kicks my ass at 60. I had to go to 20 I’m. Uh, I don’t use it right now, but I had to go to 20, which was surprised me.

[00:02:39] Brett: that’s because you’re weak.

[00:02:41] Jeff: Yeah. We

[00:02:42] Christina: go ahead. Sorry. No, I know it’s a no tell, tell, tell me you tell me what happened when you were on.

[00:02:47] Jeff: Well, two things. One is, um, I felt do you know, I used to describe being over-caffeinated as like, uh, I had this feeling of dread that something terrible was happening to somebody I [00:03:00] love right at this very moment.

[00:03:01] Right? Like it was this like almost metaphysical sort of, uh,

[00:03:06] agitation that, that coffee gave me 60 milligrams of Vyvanse me that and just made me almost impossible to talk to. Like, I was just so quick to respond, even if it wasn’t like an agitated response, just so quick to respond. And then I truly went into the like levels of hypertension.

[00:03:26] I was tracking my blood pressure and everything. So I was like, oh, wait, I got to stop this.

[00:03:31] Brett: Speaking of hypertension. So last week we recorded on Saturday. I had had quite the blowup with my parents in the morning, and I want to officially apologize for being such an asshole last week. Like I was so negative and so like angry and upset and it made for a rough episode when I had to listen to it when I was editing.

[00:03:54] So, anyway, sorry about.

[00:03:55] Jeff: I think the only, only people who deserve your apology are the give brothers.

[00:03:59] Christina: I [00:04:00] would agree with

[00:04:00] Brett: W we’ll, we’ll come back around to that. Um, so, uh, then that, like I had, I had a pretty good day, pretty relaxed chill day with my girlfriend. And then at midnight, I woke up with my heart pounding and I actually woke up around 11 with my heart pounding and I laid there for an hour waiting for it to calm down and be able to fall back asleep.

[00:04:26] But you know how, when you can hear your heart in your ear and like, you can’t follow that. To that. And like I tried rolling in every position couldn’t fall asleep and then I started to feel my chest tightening. Um, so I was like it, I don’t think it’s a heart attack. It’s probably a panic attack, but I may need to go to the ER, uh, because I’ve been awake for two hours now.

[00:04:53] It hasn’t slowed at all. And so I got my girlfriend up, we went to the ER, ended up in [00:05:00] the emergency room until 6:00 AM, uh, getting EKG and blood work and, and every test imaginable, uh, nothing came of it, but they were able to eliminate, basically, they were able to tell me I wasn’t dying. And, uh, so, so I went home, they discharged me, I went home and then within a couple hours, the chest pain became abdominal pain, like severe abdominal pain.

[00:05:29] So then I was back in urgent care and it turned out to be an obstruction. And it probably like the whole thing was probably related to the obstruction. Um, got it. Taken care of, have you ever, do you know what Golightly is?

[00:05:46] Jeff: is this for the colonoscopies?

[00:05:48] Brett: it’s the stuff they gave you before a colonoscopy. And that’s what I had to do on

[00:05:52] Sunday.

[00:05:53] Jeff: the most dishonestly named

[00:05:55] Brett: It really.

[00:05:56] Christina: all of medicine. Does it make you shit, your brains

[00:05:59] Brett: Yes, [00:06:00] four hours. And you just like, he comes in like a four or like a two, four liter jug and you have to keep pouring eight ounce glasses of it every 10 minutes and you just keep drinking it until you’re literally pooping water and it, and it just, it never ends. And then you’re falling asleep and you’re, you’re convinced like if you sneeze, you’re going to shit, the bed and it’s not fun, but you know how, you know, how studies have shown that gut health is tied to mental health.

[00:06:32] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:06:33] Brett: I’m pretty sure that this complete reset of my gut biome like ended my depression, that I’d been going through.

[00:06:40] Jeff: Um, because you shit, your brains out

[00:06:44] Brett: Exactly. And my, and my mind apparently.

[00:06:49] Jeff: that, so the, the way I have described that experience, I’ve only done it once, but I’m due to do it again. Cause I have to get a call on

[00:06:55] that speak summit old man. Do do I [00:07:00] describe it? This is so gross outside, but it’s like, you know, you got the, if you’ve got a garden, hose has like a sprayer attached to it and you’ve left it on, but you didn’t know, and you’re trying to take the sprayer off and then all of a sudden it just shoots out and then it keeps going and you’re like, fuck, I gotta get, I gotta, how do I turn this off?

[00:07:15] Like, that’s what that’s like on, on the, it comes from your butt.

[00:07:18] Brett: Oh, man. This, this episode went to sh went to, went to the toilet very quickly.

[00:07:24] Jeff: Oh, dad,

[00:07:26] Brett: Yeah.

[00:07:28] Jeff: how are you, Christina?

[00:07:30] Christina: Um, I’m, I’m good. I’m good. Um, uh, haven’t had to shoot my brains out, which is excellent. Uh, and, uh, yeah. Um, I have some other point on that I can’t talk about yet, but, but think things are fairly good. Um, my mother-in-law had surgery and we were fairly worried about it because, even though she’s in her early eighties and it’s just a scary thing for people at that age to go under anesthesia, but she got through it like a champ, that’s, that’s really good.

[00:07:57] Brett: Yeah, congrats.

[00:07:59] Jeff: Yeah, that’s [00:08:00] great. I, I don’t look forward to that period of my life where going cause already you get like a weekend, like Brett just described leaves me feeling like, am I just broken already? I can’t imagine, you know, the vulnerability of being 80

[00:08:16] Brett: They w they weren’t.

[00:08:17] Jeff: yourself.

[00:08:18] Brett: When I turned 40 they’re like you are going to, your body is going to suddenly fart start. Your body is going to suddenly start falling apart. And, and I, and I was in really good health. Uh, when I was 39, I had lost a bunch of weight and, uh, I was active. I was doing yoga three times to four times a week and getting out and hiking and feeling great.

[00:08:43] And I thought, oh, my forties will be easy, but they were right. My body started falling apart. Have fun, Christina?

[00:08:52] Christina: I mean, look, I never turning 30, so I don’t know what you’re talking about.

[00:08:56] Brett: Yeah, you’re

[00:08:56] safe.

[00:08:56] Jeff: man. You know, I wish I had made that decision and I think it’s too late.[00:09:00]

[00:09:00] Brett: You don’t have to turn 30, but I hate to say it. Your body will. We’ll see, we’ll

[00:09:08] see.

[00:09:08] Christina: that, that’s what you think. in mind. The only reason my body is the size that it is, is because I had to take human growth hormones. So like, there’s, there’s a, there’s a, there’s a lot of, of delayed this tear that I’m just hoping to milk first, as long as possible.

[00:09:25] Jeff: That’s just science.

[00:09:26] Brett: All right. So this, this story I’m about to tell you is going to lead into my good news at work for the week.

[00:09:34] Jeff: Okay.

[00:09:35] Brett: About once a year, I get a bug in, I shaved my face clean, like down to the skin and I immediately hate it, especially when I’m heavy. Uh, when, when I have extra weight on me being bare faced, I look, you can like see all of my little fat dimples and everything.

[00:09:57] Jeff: Right.

[00:09:58] Brett: I didn’t [00:10:00] consider when I got this bug last week, that the next day I was going to be going for a passport picture. you know, the pictures that lasts

[00:10:09] for 10 years? Um, and, uh, and, and I did it, I did it. I now have, uh, uh, fat Dentsply bare faced. Uh, cherubic looking, uh, passport photo, but the reason I got a passport photo is because Oracle said, Hey, do you want to go to, I think it’s pronounced Qube con like the Kubernetes conference in Valencia, Spain.

[00:10:39] And I said, sure, would love to travel to Europe. And then I Googled Valencia Spain, and, oh my God. It is so gorgeous. I cannot wait. I hope this trip goes through.

[00:10:53] Christina: That’s awesome. I haven’t been to Valencia. I’ve been disbanded for them, but I’ve never been to a Palencia, but I’m very, very [00:11:00] excited for you. This is great. And coupon is a great event.

[00:11:03] Brett: Yeah. I have a lot to learn. Kubernetes for a minute, represent Oracle. I need to not only learn about Oracle’s Kubernetes offerings. I have a lot to understand about their general. Like I have to man, a booth and I have to talk about Oracle’s cloud offerings.

[00:11:22] Christina: Look, no, one’s going to be expecting you to really say anything about Oracle’s cloud offerings, because everyone’s just surprised that there is one.

[00:11:30] Jeff: Oh man. It’s the CA it’s the, it’s the developer advocate war right in front of me. Oh, let me put on my ref shirt. Hold on.

[00:11:37] Christina: No, I I’m. I’m teasing you. I mean, I I’m I’m I’m completely kidding, but no, you’ll be great.

[00:11:44] But also like half the time, uh, at booths, I have no idea what I’m talking about. I’m just completely pulling shit out of my ass. So you’ll be completely.

[00:11:55] Brett: Th they would, they would pay to fly me to a [00:12:00] gorgeous city in Spain to stand at a booth and not know what I’m talking about

[00:12:05] Jeff: 100%.

[00:12:06] Brett: Huh?

[00:12:07] Jeff: Yep. That sounds about right

[00:12:09] Brett: on the ground boots on the

[00:12:10] Jeff: bodies and the

[00:12:10] Christina: bodies in the ground. They also want somebody who like people will be, who can at least understand some of what the people at the, at the booth are saying to them. Um, and there will be language barriers, which also adds a whole fun dynamic to it.

[00:12:22] Brett: Mm.

[00:12:23] Christina: um, I, um, I just, uh, I think you will be fine because you’re a smart guy.

[00:12:29] You will get up on what you need to get up on and never be afraid of being like, you know what, I’m not sure about that. Let me get your email. I will get back to

[00:12:40] Brett: We do

[00:12:41] Christina: that,

[00:12:41] Brett: Spaniard on the team that,

[00:12:43] will be present.

[00:12:44] Christina: which is wonderful. But, but the thing is, is that a lot of times that’s something like coupon, you will more than likely have people from more than just like who speak more than just Spanish. You’ll have a lot of Europeans.

[00:12:54] Brett: Yeah,

[00:12:55] Christina: So, so it’s one of those things where, um, uh, there can be, [00:13:00] and I just say this from experience, like there can be lots of language barriers and, um, you feel like, or at least I feel like such an asshole American I’m like, I only speak English and I’m expecting everyone else to have English skills, which most of them do because the rest of the world is better than us.

[00:13:16] And, uh, you know,

[00:13:18] frankly like,

[00:13:19] Jeff: uh,

[00:13:20] Brett: search serves as kind of like, the unofficial, uh,

[00:13:23] like universal language

[00:13:25] Jeff: it does

[00:13:26] Brett: of, Europe.

[00:13:27] Christina: it well. Yeah.

[00:13:28] Jeff: and,

[00:13:28] and, and

[00:13:29] Brett: speak a second language, it’s often English.

[00:13:32] Christina: I mean, and th this is true for most of the world, unfortunately, like we are so imperialistic in that regard, like we have, it’s such a small percentage of the population, like lives in native English, speaking things. And that is, uh, you know what, I think it is the second largest language.

[00:13:48] Um, and. There are very few places where you can go where you cannot find at least some way to do it. Although Google translate is your friend. It’s very good. Uh, you’ll have a [00:14:00] native Spaniard there. Uh, you’ll meet a lot of cool people and, um, you will learn enough to be able to bullshit with, with, I guarantee you that.

[00:14:06] Brett: Didn’t they add some kind of, uh, spoken translator to Siri recently.

[00:14:11] Christina: Yeah, but I mean, Siri’s terrible.

[00:14:14] Brett: Yeah. Okay. Fair enough.

[00:14:15] Christina: So you Google, Google translate 100%. Like don’t even fuck with any of the apple stuff. Like I don’t, I don’t care how much they promise how good it will be. That will be this it’ll be like using apple maps. You will wind up in a ditch which has happened.

[00:14:28] Brett: That’s not fair. I use apple maps all the time and I think it’s great.

[00:14:32] Jeff: Ditch, uh, you know what, I’m on this English tip. Like I, I, part of, one of the things I do for work is like a program evaluation essentially, but it’s like immersive. And so I did this evaluation for like three years of this program that was focused on the wellbeing of social entrepreneurs from around the world.

[00:14:51] So like, you know, we’ve all known people who start some organization that does some really good thing and it destroys that person. Right. And [00:15:00] so this was kind of looking at like, is there a way to do really intense social entrepreneurial work in different countries in your own country, uh, without turning yourself to ashes in your shoes, right?

[00:15:12] Like, is that possible? I part of my work was to interview around like 60 different people multiple times and, and then write up reports and we had to really like go through this interesting learning process of like, yeah, okay, everyone here speaks English, but if I want everybody here to be able to understand this report, I’ve got to use much simpler version of English than I would otherwise use in writing.

[00:15:37] And then just a couple of weeks ago on hacker news, something came up about what’s called minimal English. And I saw that. Yeah, it’s so good. And I want to, I want to figure out how to sort of incorporate it into what I’m doing, but it’s just, it literally just focuses on this idea of, you know, universal, um, English, what is the minimal English and then, and then breaks it down by sort of areas [00:16:00] of interest.

[00:16:00] What are the common words you can use? What are the words, you know, Fantastic, because like you said, Christina, like it it’s at least one way to be less of an asshole. American English speaker is to be like, okay, I humbly recognize that the rest of the world has done what I haven’t and mastered one or more, uh, other languages.

[00:16:19] Right. And now I am going to meet them more than halfway and be sure that I’m thinking about how I communicate, not just taking advantage of the fact that I’m a native English speaker. Right.

[00:16:30] Christina: Anyway. Yeah, no, no. I love that. Thank you for bringing that up because I’d read that a couple of weeks ago and I thought it was really good and I had kind of a similar thought.

[00:16:37] And when I first saw the thing on hacker news, I, I, because I just saw the headline, I was like, oh, I bet this is just, um, some like bullshit, frankly, people who, who don’t want to, uh, you know, like, like read or write well, and then I looked at it, I’m like, oh no, this is actually really, um, interesting and has a really good concept.

[00:16:57] Jeff: So yeah, definitely.

[00:16:59] Brett: Hey, [00:17:00] uh, Jeff, how would you like to do your, your inaugural sponsor? Read

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[00:17:05] Jeff: Oh, man. I’d love to do that. Hold on. Let me just stretch really quick. Little bit of voice stuff. Yup. Okay. I’m ready. Uh, okay. What do us news PC magazine and popular science have in common.

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[00:18:43] You know what? I would, I would use that for

[00:18:45] Brett: what?

[00:18:45] Jeff: it’s getting warm

[00:18:48] Brett: Yeah.

[00:18:48] Jeff: in Minneapolis. we’re actually about to have days over 40 degrees in a row, even though it started off as negative to this morning. And [00:19:00] I call our house, the severance council house of doors.

[00:19:03] We have so many doors, both inside and out of the house and then internally, and what happens every summer. Cause we have a big yard and we spend a lot of time out there just doing whatever is people come and go through every single door in the severance council house. So doors. And then what happens, invariably is you get all snuggled up in bed, you’re ready to fall asleep and, and you or your partner, my partner says is the back door locked and you’re like off and you walk downstairs and check and find out that it was.

[00:19:39] But then you realize in the morning that the sliding glass door was not locked. Right? So anyway, I really need something that can just be like, Hey, you’re good, everything’s closed and locked. That’s what I would, that’s what I would use

[00:19:50] Christina: it for. Ooh, I liked that. I liked that. And I also liked the severance console house of doors.

[00:19:56] That’s good, but I could also imagine it can be like, okay, that could be really [00:20:00] frustrating if you have all those doors and you’re like, all right, which one’s locked, which one’s unlocked.

[00:20:03] Jeff: Yes. It’s actually the worst. And to any robbers out there, if you come to my house and try a door and it’s locked, don’t stop there.

[00:20:12] Just keep going, work your way around the house. You’re going to find a way in

[00:20:15] Brett: There’s a lot of options, many,

[00:20:18] Jeff: it is the house of

[00:20:18] Christina: doors.

[00:20:23] Let’s Talk Mac

[00:20:23] Brett: Um, apple had a, an event of something less.

[00:20:27] Jeff: Yeah.

[00:20:28] Yeah.

[00:20:29] Brett: I, actually missed it I had, I had every intention of watching the event live then around 1130, I decided to go to the co-op completely forgetting that the event was even coming up. I got home at 1230 and I, it had just, it had slipped my mind.

[00:20:49] And I didn’t think about it until about two that day. And this is uh, central time. So, uh, noon would have been when it aired my time. [00:21:00] Oh well, but I, I jumped on and all of the blogs were quick to tell me everything that I missed and

[00:21:06] Christina: Right, You didn’t have to like, I mean, well, okay. So interested from user’s perspective. I did watch it live, but there have been, think since the whole pandemic and since you know, all these things are clearly prerecorded, virtual things. There’s less.

[00:21:21] Brett: that way.

[00:21:22] Christina: It’s better that way, but there’s also a sense where you’re like, okay, I don’t have to watch this live.

[00:21:27] Like if I know that somebody is his record has prerecorded it, like, and, and I, and that’s obviously how they do it. Cause it’s how the production things work. And I’m sure apple loves that because they can make it absolutely perfect and, and whatnot. Um, and I’ve done enough of them, uh, now for Microsoft, uh, on our end to, to know, like we we’ve done a lot of things live, but we’ve done a lot of things, prerecorded that then air at a certain time.

[00:21:52] Like, I, I don’t know. I, I feel like when I know that the impetus for me to be like, yep, I have to be gluten [00:22:00] at exactly this time. It’s like, just, it’s not there yet.

[00:22:04] Jeff: Yeah, same, but for me it stopped prior to the prerecorded things. I was just really, really tired of being like, is this really my, my family?

[00:22:15] Like, it’s just like, it’s like these guys and these, I mean, they’re just so corny and, you know, it’s like, just give me the thing. And, and then I was like, well, wait, I don’t have to be here. Cause I was, I would totally organize my day around that shit. You know, like I’d have all the, you know, like Twitter feeds up and whatever and all excited.

[00:22:33] And then there’s just a point where I’m like, think I might be carrying too much and in the wrong ways.

[00:22:40] Brett: So there, the, the announcement. Oh, so like, all I wanted was a more powerful Mac mini. Like if You would ask me, what is your one dream that apple could or announced? I would have said a more powerful Mac mini one that can handle more than 16 gigs of Ram

[00:22:58] Jeff: Hmm.

[00:22:58] Brett: with, maybe with a [00:23:00] max chip. And when I saw the max studio announcement, I immediately started specking out my next computer.

[00:23:09] I’m I’m super excited. Um, it’s, it’s a, it’s a pro mini.

[00:23:14] Jeff: It is, it

[00:23:15] Christina: is, it was so funny because you were actually the person I thought of, and I was like, okay, who is the target for this? I was like, well, obviously video editors, you know, that’s, that’s the, the core component of people that are going after for this. This is a video editor machine, maybe audio, editors, whatever, um, that, because that the people who will be able to use that workload, um, who are, uh, cause people who would otherwise be able to use this sort of GPU and Ram power in some professional applications.

[00:23:38] I, I hate to say this, but this is the truth. Like if they’re doing machine learning work, they are not using max at this

[00:23:44] Brett: Right.

[00:23:44] Christina: can’t, can’t because the tooling is not there. It maybe it’ll show up there. Most of them are using Linux or windows and people can get at me on that, but I’m right.

[00:23:55] Uh, Jeff can attest to

[00:23:57] Jeff: that, that one, I was going to make [00:24:00] a similar point, but you made it

[00:24:01] Christina: better. Yeah. Um, but, uh, but the other person that the other group I was thinking of, I was like, this is a Bret term store machine.

[00:24:09] Brett: Yeah.

[00:24:09] Christina: Like this is a complete term drum machine. Like, I don’t know if you would get the ultra,

[00:24:13] but

[00:24:13] Jeff: the,

[00:24:14] Brett: I’m debating that. Like, I don’t think I need 20 cores.

[00:24:18] Jeff: I don’t think you do

[00:24:19] Brett: I think I’d be fine with, with a max. And I think that maxes out at 64 gigs of Ram,

[00:24:25] Christina: Yeah, it does.

[00:24:26] I think 64 gigs. That’s what I was thinking. I was like, get 64 gigs and whatever, you know, size SSD you want. I think that’s

[00:24:33] your machine.

[00:24:34] Brett: learned two terabytes is what I actually need combined with a Synology and external SSDs. I don’t anything more than two terabytes is a waste. So yeah, that actually comes out, I think, around three grand for the machine.

[00:24:48] you just mentioned, I can afford the five to six grand. It would cost me to max it out, but I just don’t know if I can justify

[00:24:59] Jeff: Right.

[00:24:59] Brett: [00:25:00] couple grand that would take.

[00:25:02] Christina: Well, because if you’re not going to use it, like in my mind it becomes kind of a thing. Like if you’re not actually going to use it, we,

[00:25:08] Brett: do some video editing, but honestly I’ve done video editing on my M one mini and, and for my purposes, I do our. It takes hours to render something. But

[00:25:20] Christina: yeah. Well, I mean, the thing is, is that even if you do, um, that, um, They’re so good at this point. Cause like, uh, Jeff, you just got a 16 inch max book and I have the 14 inch max book and we’re going to talk about it. Uh, it is great and it is great and video editing and, and this is basically a max book without a screen.

[00:25:39] So I think you’d be great. Like, I don’t think you would need an ultra for the video editing you’re doing, you’re not doing 10 streams of 4k footage rate K footage or whatever the hell they were showing up, which is awesome, but you’re not doing

[00:25:51] that.

[00:25:51] Brett: just, I needed to hear you say that.

[00:25:53] because I didn’t think I did. Uh, but having, having someone, especially someone who already owns a [00:26:00] max and can say, this is all You need. That’s, that’s good to know

[00:26:03] Jeff: You know what pleases me and pisses me off is the thing that I find most attractive about having this computer is similar to what I love most about my new Mac book. Is that look at how they put two USB-C or maybe it’s the Moodle ports and a fucking SD card reader facing you

[00:26:26] Christina: the front, the front facing shit.

[00:26:28] I’m like

[00:26:29] Brett: and

[00:26:30] Christina: clearly Johnny IPE has left the building.

[00:26:31] Brett: there’s bore vulnerable ports on the back.

[00:26:34] Jeff: But this is what makes people hate Mac users. Is that like, I’m that excited about that? It does definitely reveal what a sucker I am, but man, I have the, um, the iMac pro the, the last version that they made. Right. And it’s got a lot of good parts, but Jesus Christ, you can’t get to them.

[00:26:52] I spent so much time. I’ve contemplated putting a mirror near the backup.

[00:26:58] Brett: Yeah, I have to, I, [00:27:00] I, I pass all ports out to a

[00:27:02] Jeff: I haven’t no, I have a doc. I don’t pass all too. That’s a good, okay. I don’t do that. Like, I’ll put monitors straight in, um, and things like that. And I’d still, but the SD card reader, which I know a doc, I’m just saying, I paid a lot of money for this computer.

[00:27:17] And if I paid that much money for a computer that already has an SD card reader, just put it on the side. At

[00:27:22] Christina: least I agree. I agree because I have a 20, 20 iMac and I had a 2017 iMac before that. And I’ve actually knowing my 2017 I’m at, cause it came out right before the iMac pro and it was one of those things where I’d bought it.

[00:27:35] And I was like, are you fucking kidding me? One of those things, I was like, I would have bought the iMac pro, um, and, and said, I got it. I have the completely maxed out, like the last Intel Mac, um, like the I nine with the, uh, with 128 gigs of Ram. And, um, I aftermarket did not pay apple prices would not do that.

[00:27:55] Um, uh, the, the, you know, highest end graphics card, which. [00:28:00] Little did we know that it would be very, very difficult for anyone to get graphics cards. So that was actually a goodbye. Um, and, and so I’ve loved that machine, but, um, yes. Having to have like fumble around the back and I’ve got it on a, on a visa, um, I got the base of model, so I have it on an arm, which then has a whole other thing.

[00:28:21] So I was just like, okay. Yeah. So I, I have a doc, I have, um, um, one of the, uh, Cal Cal digit, um, docs.

[00:28:28] Jeff: Yeah. It’s I sh I should have done that. Cause it’s like changing a fucking spark plug. Just like getting your monitor plugged in or whatever. Right, right. It’s just ridiculous. Now you guys said that Johnny ive is gone and now we have these ports, but man, he ain’t all the way gone.

[00:28:42] Cause that’s still a kind of a piss-poor offering. I feel like they got room to give us a couple more in there and it’s can still be pretty.

[00:28:49] Christina: I mean they do, but like, look beggars can’t be choosers. Yes, we got MagSafe back. We got SD cards. They gave four thunder, four thunderbolts, as you mentioned on the back

[00:28:59] [00:29:00] of the studio

[00:29:01] Brett: the max for that bus.

[00:29:03] Christina: that is in and on the ultra, the front ports are also, uh,

[00:29:09] Jeff: but let’s be honest.

[00:29:10] Uh it’s beggars who are willing to spend thousands of dollars on a computer. Can’t

[00:29:14] Brett: Sure, sure.

[00:29:15] Jeff: the same logic

[00:29:16] Christina: ring. Correct? You’re correct. You are correct. It’s beggars who are in this position because of their own bullshit.

[00:29:24] Brett: Ooh,

[00:29:25] Cal did you Cal, did you has a Thunderbolt for dogs? Is that the one you have?

[00:29:30] Christina: Um, okay. So I had the three one, and

[00:29:32] Brett: Yeah.

[00:29:32] Christina: four on order from PNH. And, um, and it actually was recently in stock on Amazon. And I should’ve canceled by BNH order and ordered on Amazon, but this was the difficult thing I got it covered by. So at work, they give us like a certain amount of money a year.

[00:29:50] It used to be for health and wellness stuff. So I used to get my apple watch paid for, but they’ve now expanded it. So it can be used for office type of things too. [00:30:00] And for hobbies. So like last year it paid for my microphone and um, this year it paid for, um, I got a mixing board and I got a bunch of Ergotron arms and I got, um, A a, I got that doc, but my fear was, if I cancel, I I’d already got, I’d already expensed it and gotten my refund for it.

[00:30:22] And so I didn’t want to go through a thing where like, if they did an audit of some sort and they were like, oh, well you cancel this being a shorter, I am going to have to like submit a refund claim and then have to resubmit like a new claim that I bought it from Amazon. You see what I’m saying? And I think that the, the likelihood of anybody actually auditing that is probably non-existent, but for things like that, I didn’t want to fuck around.

[00:30:50] So I will have that one, but instead I have, and they, and I should, I should disclose this. Um, um, Cal digits sent me four years ago. They sent me [00:31:00] the Thunderbolt three dock, um, in exchange for being, for being able to use like tweets that I used on their webpage, which I don’t even think they ever used. Um,

[00:31:09] Brett: a hell of a deal.

[00:31:10] Christina: I, if I liked it, I love that thing

[00:31:13] Brett: Yeah, that’s what I have. It’s my favorite doc.

[00:31:16] Christina: And, and so I, I very happily spent the money on the, on the Thunderbolt for one because, um, and, and, and I probably could’ve finagled a similar situation as I got with a three, but I,

[00:31:30] but, but

[00:31:30] Brett: you in tweets.

[00:31:32] Christina: honestly, um, I, I probably could have done that. Exactly. I probably could have done that, but, uh, and I just say, this is the, not a sponsor.

[00:31:40] Maybe we can get them as a sponsor. Um, since all three of us like them, um, that would actually be cool, but this was a situation where I was like, actually, no, I just want to give you my money because it’s been that good of a product.

[00:31:55] Brett: Have you

[00:31:55] Jeff: That’s awesome.

[00:31:56] Brett: Mac studio page on apple.com

[00:31:59] Jeff: [00:32:00] Yes,

[00:32:00] Brett: the like with the squirrel? It’s amazing. Um,

[00:32:04] Jeff: it’s really good.

[00:32:05] Brett: I was like, how do I see the back of this? then I just started scrolling and it spun around and then it zoomed into it. And then there were splashes and colors and it, yeah.

[00:32:16] Jeff: I just ended up on the cosmetics website.

[00:32:19] Brett: What,

[00:32:20] Jeff: No, no, no. Max studio by micro dental laboratory. Well, okay.

[00:32:25] Christina: Well, okay. We’ll we’ll, we’ll the funny, the funny thing is, is when they said Mac studio, I was like, okay. Cause I actually use Mac as my makeup brand and I have for, since I was in high school. So, and, and, and the, uh, foundations I use is called studio fixed.

[00:32:41] So this is now very funny for me. So like, honestly, I am a little bit surprised now that you mentioned this, had not occurred to me before. There is a real trademark. Complaint that I think Mac cosmetics could have.

[00:32:55] Jeff: And I’m about genuinely. And I’m about to drop a link in [00:33:00] the show notes that will show you, uh, just how similar these products are.

[00:33:05] Not, it’s really delightful, but we keep talking. It’ll take me a

[00:33:09] Christina: minute. Yeah, no, so, I mean, I mean, obviously they’re, they’re completely different, you know, product wise, but like in terms of the name, mark I’m with you, you know what I mean? Like, cause cause Mac studio like, like Mac cosmetics has had that line for, over 20 years guys, cause again, using it in high school.

[00:33:28] Uh, and, and, and, and I know I’m always 29. I’m not actually 29. So it’s, it’s been more than it’s been more than two decades. Um, because I’ve been putting it on my face that long I’m color in three, by the way. excellent. Which, which, which shows how pale my skin is, because I think the scale starts. Oh, and it goes to

[00:33:49] Jeff: like, oh, his how?

[00:33:50] okay. Got it. Yeah. Yeah. Well the new Mac studio teeth are amazing. sorry, Brett. I [00:34:00] was trying to go to the Mac studio website and wound up in the land of dental implants.

[00:34:05] Brett: By micro dental laboratories.

[00:34:10] Jeff: That’s fine. I wonder if they got just generally like a lot more hits over the last

[00:34:14] Christina: week. Oh, I bet they did. I bet they did. Everybody’s like, wait, wait. I was actually looking for a computer, but now that you mentioned it, I could use some dental implants,

[00:34:24] Jeff: apple.

[00:34:26] Christina: You know, I mean, if apple had a dentistry, you know, that it would be like, if I could get, cause I want to get veneers and I could keep the nears from apple, they would be the best veneers they would cost so much money.

[00:34:37] Yeah. They would be the perfect shade of white.

[00:34:40] Jeff: Some of those, you get some of those real thin Johnny

[00:34:42] Christina: ive teeth. Yup. Yup. they be perfect. Right? Like they would be, it would have like, they wouldn’t be an imperfect group is somewhat imperfect. Yeah. They be machine, but they’ve been machine exactly to your teeth.

[00:34:54] They be like, um, you know, uh, cause, cause that that’s, the trend is not to [00:35:00] have the fake looking perfect ones, but to have like, it, like them actually capture your real teeth and then, and then do it. And um, I am, I got fitted for it and I was going to do it. And then I didn’t finish my whitening process to get them as white as I’d wanted them to match too.

[00:35:14] And then COVID happened. And so, and so I need to go back and, and get, get on the train again. It’s going to be like, like 10 grand, but I’m going to do it.

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[00:37:09] And Now For Something Completely The Same

[00:37:09] Brett: goes great with designer teeth and, and fancy Macs.

[00:37:14] Christina: Yeah. And so suggest. So you’ve just got a 16 inch max book. Yes. Right. Tell

[00:37:19] Jeff: us about it. The most important thing about it is that it’s my first laptop since my early 20 15, 13 inch Mac book.

[00:37:29] Christina: Okay. So, so, so you had like the last good.

[00:37:33] Jeff: Yeah. And th and that’s why it’s been that long. It’s like, I’ve, I’ve had to get laptops for, you know, colleagues or people that work on my project to use.

[00:37:42] And every time I get 'em, I’m like, oh, this is the new Mac book. And I was like, oh, this is, this is terrible. And, and I thought, well, I never have what I like again. And, and primarily, like, what I like is like girth and ports. Like, I don’t, I don’t [00:38:00] need it or want it to be really, really, really skinny. And I totally want to have an SD card reader.

[00:38:07] If I’m going to spend all that money on a goddamn laptop, like that’s still a thing I still end up needing them. Um,

[00:38:14] Christina: and most people, because you’re recording things from audio sources, you might have like, you know, footage from a camera, like,

[00:38:21] Jeff: yeah. And I’m like a raspberry PI nerd. So I’m flashing Linux onto some micro SD cards and stuff like that, you know?

[00:38:28] Um, and, and the HTMI port and all that stuff. The funny thing is, even though I knew this was not the case, and I haven’t even talked about the fact that it’s so damn powerful. Right. But like, even though I knew it wasn’t the case that there was a disc drive in there. It has two slots on the bottom that looked like they could be Johnny ive just drives.

[00:38:47] And I was like, no way. Um, so anyway, like I, I love the form factor so much. The speakers are amazing. Like I am blown away by the quality. Sound that comes [00:39:00] out of that thing. Um, granted, I, you know, I’m comparing this to 2015, so I don’t really know what’s when it got better, right?

[00:39:08] Christina: Well, I have, I have the 14 inch, not the 16 inch and I, and the 16 inch is definitely better, but everybody, every review I read commented, um, on how good the speakers were.

[00:39:16] And this includes people who just reviewed laptops for a living. So I think that, that even though I think the last 16 inch MacBook, like the one that Brett has, I think that was good, but I think this is even better.

[00:39:28] Jeff: man. I mean, I’m truly blown away. I actually throw it up that whole laptop up on my treadmill I.

[00:39:34] Go straight off the audio of the laptop. No problem. Even for like a TV show with dialogue and whatever else. Uh, and then just like the display. It’s huge. I love it. It’s so, so huge. Um, and that’s just the outsides, but honestly, like as much as I, I love the insides and the fact that this gave me an excuse to do a totally justified clean install rather than one that I can’t fully justify, [00:40:00] except for mental health reasons.

[00:40:01] Um, it is. It is just a pleasure to handle. And I feel a little silly about that because I recognize that I just spent a lot of money have a computer whose like strengths I’m describing as it’s big and heavy and has ports. And that is what it’s like to be a Mac person. It is. What about you? What about you?

[00:40:24] Yeah,

[00:40:24] Christina: no, I’ve had the similar experience where I’d been rocking. Um, I mean, I have my iMac, which I love, but for, you know, my laptop purposes, which, which was like my main work machine and, and stuff like that, it was a 20 17, 13 inch. And. I tried with that thing, you know, but I missed my, my 20 13, 15 inch a lot because the same things, you mentioned, ports and HTMI and things like that.

[00:40:51] Like when I used to travel, um, back when travel was a thing, it was always one of those things. I had to travel with a number of different adapters to [00:41:00] use with different projection systems, because the display port, um, stuff, mini display port, even if the projector has it, sometimes it’s finicky and sometimes doesn’t work.

[00:41:11] So I would have to use, like, I would have to have multiple USBC output things like one that would have like an HTMI one that would have a display port, one that would have, you know, even BGA if I needed it. So having that HTMI is huge. And actually ironically, even in our studio, um, at Microsoft, where I go in, if I’m trying to connect, um, a monitor to an.

[00:41:31] Studio, um, uh, display, um, they have an adapter on a USB. They have an adapter basically that is like a USBC adapter that they’ve got on the end of one cable. And for whatever reason, whenever I plug in the it into a USBC port on my Mac, it doesn’t quite work, but the HTMI cable works perfectly. So there’s yeah, exactly.

[00:41:53] There’s just because Apple’s always done weird things with their, I think what it is is that they demand [00:42:00] like exacting standards on the display stuff that it connects to, which I guess is technically correct, but most other people will allow a little more wiggle room in the spec, which I think is frankly probably a better news.

[00:42:13] So I know that that’s a silly thing. Yeah, having that port there is huge. Right? Um, it’s so fast. It’s silent. The battery life is really good. It’s so quiet. Yeah. Now all of us are now on, in one machines, but we’re also on Intel machines. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:42:30] Jeff: All of us.

[00:42:31] Brett: I’ve a quick, I have a

[00:42:32] Jeff: It’s like having two houses in Minecraft. Sorry.

[00:42:35] Brett: um, on your, on your max books, how many

[00:42:39] Jeff: Okay.

[00:42:39] Brett: how many external displays can, can they support?

[00:42:43] Jeff: Oh, I don’t know yet. I assume.

[00:42:45] Christina: Is it for, I think it is.

[00:42:48] Brett: These, the max studio can support five displays, which is I

[00:42:52] Jeff: And a TV.

[00:42:53] Brett: on my M one Mac mini it only, only supports one display. [00:43:00] I’m able to run two by using a display port dock through USBC, combined with HTMI. Um, and it works fine, but it’s, uh, the, the idea of having, being able to have multiple displays.

[00:43:13] That’s cool. Anyway, we we’re talking about, we’re talking about why we can’t just have M one max. Why, why we can’t have nice things.

[00:43:21] Christina: Okay. Here, here we go. Here we go. Um, simultaneously support, spool native, uh, built-in up to, um, up to three external displays with up to six K resolution and one external display with the 4k resolution on the, in one max. So six K screens one 4k screen at the same time.

[00:43:39] Brett: That’s so many Ks.

[00:43:41] Jeff: Yeah.

[00:43:42] Brett: Cool. Cool. Um, yeah, the only reason I still need a, an Intel machine is because of that weird bug in X code and web kit. That means I can’t compile Mart. I can’t compile a working version of mark [00:44:00] using, uh, uh, an M one Mac. I can compile it for M one, put it, it has to be compiled on an Intel chip.

[00:44:08] If I could get past that bug, I could let go of my Intel.

[00:44:13] Christina: Interesting. Okay. So for me, the holdup, if I’m being real is still in, it’s gotten better, but it’s still not great is, is Docker. Um, so you’re talking about, you know, coupon, that stuff is still not great. Um, Docker does finally have, um, and, and, and I’ve actually been using rancher as opposed to Docker desktop.

[00:44:33] Docker’s going through some, some shit right now. Um, uh, they do have arm builds and they do have things that can run in Rosetta, but there are still Docker images that I will find that will not necessarily work because they were not built for, um, you know, a arch and, um, that can sometimes be a problem.

[00:44:56] And in virtualization, if you’re using, um, [00:45:00] uh, you know, uh, I think they call it hyper kit, which is like their hypervisor kit. Like, it’s pretty good, but there are some limitations in terms of what stuff you can do, because Rosetta is only working with the compatibility of that only works really on like the Mac side.

[00:45:17] So if you’re like running the Linux distro or, or something, or, you know, even like an arm version of windows, which was then having to do some sort of compatibility thing on its own, like, you can’t do that. So. It’s not even so much that I’m like, oh, I need to run windows. Cause it’s not that it’s like, I would like to be able to like do virtualization and run Docker containers and things like that.

[00:45:39] And it is better experience to use an Intel machine for that purpose.

[00:45:44] Brett: Alright. I like you can’t install any previous versions of most like Python and Ruby, uh, even node, uh, have you have trouble installing older, older versions on an ?

[00:45:59] Jeff: Right.

[00:45:59] Brett: don’t [00:46:00] compile for the architecture. Uh, so I guess

[00:46:03] Jeff: Exactly.

[00:46:04] Brett: but I have been able to run all of the previous versions I need for testing using Docker.

[00:46:10] Christina: Okay. So, so what’s worked for you. Okay. That’s good. Cause I’ve had some instances it’s been and I, and, and some of it might be fixed, but it’s, you know, it’s one of those things where like, if you run into a breaking thing at one point and, and then, and it, and it’s kind of a pain in the ass. Or I could just use my Intel machine.

[00:46:27] That’s what you’re going to do. And I’m not going to like continue to keep so things, my information could be somewhat out of date even in the last couple of months, but, uh, that’s there have been still been some challenges with that case. I think that that’s the, and I, I predicted this I, I not happy to have been right about that, but I predicted when they did the transition, I was like, I think that the most difficult part is going to be some of the lower level dev tools that are edge cases that are for understandable reasons.

[00:46:58] Just [00:47:00] not on anybody’s

[00:47:01] Brett: Well, it took, it took a while for like all of the Homebrew to, uh, To

[00:47:07] Jeff: Yeah.

[00:47:08] Brett: up, but by the time, they started developing the new or like updating the architecture for home brew formula is as soon as the, uh, developer tool kit, Mac minis came out by the time they actually actually released the first M one Mac minis.

[00:47:27] Uh, most of that had been

[00:47:30] Jeff: Yeah.

[00:47:31] Brett: most, most of it had been taken care of. You can pretty much anything that’s on Homebrew. can brew install on an M one. Um,

[00:47:38] Christina: Yeah, no, they did a great job with that and they got that pretty, um, pretty like fast with that. But, um, but yeah, uh, and that was, that was worked out long before I got my, um, first machine, but, uh, Uh, but yeah, I, uh, but there still been some issues with some other things, I’m sorry. Go on. What, what, what, uh, what are you, so you said [00:48:00] Minecraft, but other things are no, no,

[00:48:01] Jeff: no, not Minecraft, but I was saying it’s like having too many houses in Minecraft.

[00:48:05] Where do I keep all the like iron? Um, no, for me, it’s so obvious code is still funny for me. Uh, with the M one, although I’ve heard it’s gotten better, but when I first, uh, loaded it up on my Mac mini, um, which was about two months ago, it was just freezing up on me all the time. And when I look at

[00:48:25] Christina: the, and you were using the arm build, you’re using like the actual apple Silicon build.

[00:48:29] Jeff: So maybe not, I mean, it told me it was running on Rosetta

[00:48:34] Christina: and not using the right belt.

[00:48:37] Jeff: Okay. So I’m using the wrong build. Well, welcome to basics with Jeffy.

[00:48:42] Christina: but this is a problem, right? I mean, cause they do, they do put it on the website, but I think, and I’m actually going to pass that to the co team to see if they can do a better job of figuring out what version you should be downloaded.

[00:48:55] And I’m

[00:48:56] Jeff: wondering I would have, I would have installed it through home brew. So I wonder [00:49:00] if the, what they have on Homebrew.

[00:49:03] Christina: Well, you know, what it might be. I think they offer a universal build and a universal build might not do a great job of determining what you need to do. And so you need to actually get the apple Silicon build.

[00:49:12] Oh, that makes

[00:49:12] Jeff: me so happy because, um, and thank you. Uh, the office left for me is this really incredible, um, software called max QDA, which is qualitative data analysis software that I use all the time, unfortunately, in my job. And so until that is right. Um, which won’t be till the summer.

[00:49:34] Apparently I can’t completely let go of my iMac, which I’d actually like to just sell and, and put against the cost of the laptop I got, but I got to wait.

[00:49:44] Brett: Christina. We’ll probably never have a use case for max QDA, but she would appreciate that app. It is intensely cool.

[00:49:52] Jeff: It’s

[00:49:52] Christina and Jeff: amazing.

[00:49:53] Jeff: You basically just dump a bunch of texts into it, you know, usually interviewed transcripts and, and there are all of these ways [00:50:00] in which you can sort of code what’s there and then look across documents. And there’s like a lot of software that does that in the academic world. I’m not an academic.

[00:50:08] Um, and I found this particular developer there in Germany to just be like, amazingly user-friendly because I’m on this kick, which I won’t go into now about making qualitative analysis accessible to anybody, which is currently not the case. It’s like, it’s sort of protected in that fake academic way where it’s like, why I don’t under, I don’t understand three of the 15 words you just said, so this obviously isn’t for me, you know, but anyway, right.

[00:50:34] But

[00:50:36] Christina: that’s in that that’s.

[00:50:38] Jeff: Yeah. For the moment. I mean, you know, it can run on, it has, uh, it can run on Rosetta. Right. But like not, well, it’s, it’s just not it’s super buggy.

[00:50:48] Got it.

[00:50:48] Brett: I haven’t had any, like, it.

[00:50:50] has been practically seamless to me stuff that has to use Rosetta. Um, I’ve been really impressed with how well, my M one runs [00:51:00] Intel stuff without me having to even notice.

[00:51:03] Christina: Yeah. And then of course there are a couple of apps that just flat out don’t work, like, um, uh, our, our beloved call recorder.

[00:51:10] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah. every once in a while you open some and you’re like, oh, oh,

[00:51:14] Brett: It’s probably stuff that have to get down to like low level audio bridge.

[00:51:19] Christina: Yeah, no 100%. And, and, and the, and e-comm has, has said that they will no longer be they will not be bringing it to the, um, in one Mac that cause the architecture and things are too different. They’ve already had to do enough, like kind of work arounds to even get the Intel version, to continue to work with the various versions of Skype.

[00:51:36] Like it’s just, it’s become, I think

[00:51:38] they can get too much technical debt

[00:51:40] Brett: them. Yeah.

[00:51:42] Christina: as, and, and their, their big focus has been on their e-comm live product, which is kind of like a Mac version of OBS.

[00:51:48] Brett: Yeah.

[00:51:49] Christina: and I, I don’t blame them. That would be, I would think a much better business model. That’s also something they sell monthly.

[00:51:57] Although I have a grandfathered, uh, [00:52:00] professional license, but that is like a, uh, a monthly subscription that they sell versus. I, I can’t fault them. I paid for call recorder in 2007. I want to say it lasted forever. And I got so much use out of it. Like I,

[00:52:16] Brett: Does

[00:52:16] Christina: yeah.

[00:52:17] Brett: actually work for e-comm now? Or does he just love e-comm live?

[00:52:21] Jeff: I think he works for them now.

[00:52:22] Brett: Okay. Yeah. With the amount he pimps it, he really should be getting paid.

[00:52:27] Christina: Yeah. I I’m, I’m pretty, I’m pretty positive like that, that is that he does work for them now, which is great. Um, I’m glad to have somebody like him working for them, but yeah, that that’s, that’s like one of the only ones where I was like saying farewell, like in a deep way, because not that you can’t use other tools and obviously, um, audio hijack is awesome.

[00:52:47] But in terms of, of TKI teaching people like having just a utility, you could point someone towards to be able to record both sides of their Skype conversation. There’s been nothing better than, than calling.

[00:52:59] Brett: No, [00:53:00] it’s perfect. And it can export split tracks, right. From, uh, it’s built in tools and everything. Yeah, for sure. Okay. We have about, uh, a few minutes left. Let’s hear about, uh, mint mobile. Uh, I’m going to turn it over to Christina and then we can debate our closing topic is going to be

[00:53:20] Jeff: All right. And then have that be the end. It just doesn’t

[00:53:24] debate.

[00:53:24] Brett: debate.

[00:53:25] Sponsor: Mint Mobile

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[00:53:47] And Brett, I know that you’ve been really happy about your, your, your switch to mobile, right?

[00:53:52] Brett: I added up my savings and I’m saving almost a thousand dollars this year, just on my wireless bill. Um, so that [00:54:00] money will absolutely be going towards a Mac studio, which is just a way better investment than, than wireless. I don’t, I don’t even barely use.

[00:54:10] Christina: That’s so great. That’s awesome. Uh, and, uh, if you like bread or are looking to save up to like a thousand dollars this year, if you want to buy a Mac studio with, with your savings, um, memorable offers premium wireless for just 15 bucks a month, and they do this by going online only and eliminating the traditional costs of retail.

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[00:54:48] within mobile, you can choose the amount of monthly data that’s right for you. And then you can stop paying for that data that you never use, which is great. Cause like that’s so frustrating. A lot of times like, ah, well, I, I really only need [00:55:00] this much, but I’m paying for way more and, and you don’t have to do that here.

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[00:55:23] Tip Your Developers, and Try The Steak

[00:55:23] Brett: All right. So we could, we could quickly revisit the PGS. Although I feel like that’s, that’s a pretty long conversation, uh, where that path led me.

[00:55:33] Jeff: Okay.

[00:55:34] Brett: like I, I really, I

[00:55:36] Christina: Well, let’s say that. Let’s say that because, because you came, you came with some good revolution relations update for, for people who don’t follow the Twitter feed, which is completely fair. Brett did give the BGS a try.

[00:55:47] Jeff: He,

[00:55:47] Brett: fucking watched Saturday night fever to try to understand we’ll get into this. We’ll talk.

[00:55:53] Christina: okay. So he, you really, really tried. Wow. That is like you went all out huge a for effort. Um, [00:56:00] uh, you know, Saturday night fever was based. I think it was a, was it a rolling stone or a village voice article? It was one of those anyway. Um, good try on that. So we can say that for, for, for, for a future episode and I’m sorry, you didn’t like them though.

[00:56:14] That that was, that was the end result. Was he, he tried very hard, but still hastes brothers give.

[00:56:20] Brett: Um, but I did like Jeff’s, I feel like Jeff’s a gratitude practice for the next week would be a good closing topic.

[00:56:29] Jeff: Yeah, I like this. Okay. And I may want to ask some questions more in depth next week, but here’s, here’s what I’m going to here’s I’m going to set it up. I am, I, I want to, you know, I’m, I’m putting all this software on a, my new Mac and I’m revisiting, uh, apps that I haven’t spent time with in awhile.

[00:56:47] Scrivener is a great example. Um, and I’m just feeling so grateful to developers and who make my life better. And who seemed to anticipate my needs in a way that seems [00:57:00] bizarre, or maybe my needs are just very common. Um, and I want to spend the week thanking developers and, and I’m curious to hear from both of you about the best ways like to thank a developer and I’m especially interested in this sort of divide between like, you know, Indian and corporate, like vs code, you know, Thank the people who do, you know, get integration or, or wrote that right.

[00:57:24] In vs code as an example. Right. Uh, and that’s a little less straight forward to me than thinking like Bret Turkstra. Right. So, anyway, I’m curious to get your thoughts on the best way for me to go about, uh, thanking developers over the next week and I’ll report back next week,

[00:57:41] Brett: Yeah. Like, I don’t know how you would think like, uh, major corporate, creators of applications, but those things like the get integration, there’s probably, uh, if, especially if it’s an extension, there’s probably an individual developer you can find

[00:57:58] Jeff: 100%

[00:57:59] Christina: [00:58:00] and there, and, and, and there’s more than likely even, even a log. Um, if you were to look like in the release notes, sometimes it would show what people would be there. Um, but, um, I mean, I, I can’t speak for all corporate stuff. I can say, I know like, Budding the act code team know, or if you see people who are, if you look through the Elisa and you see people who are doing that stuff, if you want to give them a shout out, like they appreciate that.

[00:58:24] And they track those things, you know? So substance, so some, so some PM somewhere is going to be looking at that stuff. And we’ll, we’ll more than likely get that to somebody, even if you just wanted to say something on Twitter or, or you might even on previous codes case you might even be able to, to, I don’t know if, if a PR would be the right thing or if they’d have give a feedback, um, a repo or whatever that might be a place to, to just express thanks on GitHub itself.

[00:58:50] But.

[00:58:51] Brett: indie software, if it’s, it’s something like I published, that’s free, But.

[00:58:56] takes donations the obvious way to say thank you is [00:59:00] a $5 donation. but for indie stuff like Scribner that you can get on the Mac app store a five-star review, and you can, you can add a five-star review with every new version that comes out.

[00:59:14] Jeff: Oh, interesting.

[00:59:15] Brett: done it recently, go add another five star review. It really does help

[00:59:20] Jeff: Okay. And, and when I gathered that it’s the five stars that really, really matters. But if you’re, if you’re writing something as well, what, what is the thing to emphasize that makes it a valuable, a five star review?

[00:59:34] Brett: Uh, just what it’s done for you. Like a lot of times having a specific use case that, you know, I, I needed this app to do this, and it really came through for me because those are the reviews when someone has like a very particular use case. And it’s not clearly elucidated in the, you know, the more info screen, uh, to find someone else [01:00:00] who has your use case, uh, it can be like, that’s, that’ll be what sells you on it.

[01:00:06] So if you have a particular use case that the software really excelled at that makes for a great written review.

[01:00:13] Jeff: Hmm. Hmm. And Christina, when you talk about, I mean, when you talk about things being tracked right. Which is kind of what I was assuming or wondering about. Cause it’s not like, I want to say like, thank you, Microsoft for dah, dah, dah. Right. Like I really want, I want to find that person in there that’s like our people, right.

[01:00:29] Who’s doing this thing. And I wanna, I wanna, I want to help by saying wonderful work, but not that it matters what, what Jeff

[01:00:36] Christina: says. Right. Okay. And to make them feel good to know that. Yeah. So, so like sometimes like the, the best thing I say would usually be like, if the, if the program itself has like a Twitter handle, so, and coats cases, it’s at code.

[01:00:48] Um, and I’m actually gonna look as soon as we get off this, I’m going to see if I can figure out who’s been responsible for. Um, the, the get integration. And, and are you talking about the, the, uh, the, uh, the pull [01:01:00] request extension? Are you talking about the actual just version control integration?

[01:01:03] Jeff: I just like, it comes naturally in it.

[01:01:06] I didn’t have to activate it, you know, and it was just,

[01:01:08] Christina: it’s beautiful. Yeah. So, so that might be, I’m not even sure, but that’s the sort of thing where, um, sometimes what you can also do, like, uh, like you can find people who are the bosses on that stuff, and sometimes say like, whoever, you know, your team responsible for this, I really appreciate it.

[01:01:25] And they might see it.

[01:01:26] Jeff: If you had to guess to mate, um, something like vs code, how many bosses, uh, have vs code in their portfolio?

[01:01:42] Five or six, five or six. Okay.

[01:01:44] Christina: But I can bet Chris, Chris Davis, Amanda silver, uh, are going to be the two big people. I’ll get you a list. I happen to know just for this one, cause I know, I know that this team, um, but, um, uh, but it, it depends, uh, there, there are a number of different people who do it. I [01:02:00] think ultimately it goes up to, to, to someone else.

[01:02:02] But, um, I can, again, this is one of the reasons why for a project like that, I know they track things. So if you mentioned, I just want to, you know, kudos unit to the ad code team for, for this people will see it, uh, for certain things like for instance, like windows terminal, uh, as an example, I know that team fairly well.

[01:02:21] And you can see, because again, they do everything on open source. You can see a lot of the people who are doing a lot of the commits and, and the PMs who were doing that stuff. So you can find things more easily for some corporate stuff it’s harder, right? Like, I wouldn’t know where to start for the office team.

[01:02:35] Right. But I, I. Probably again, like start with the handle. Um,

[01:02:41] Jeff: one thing though, whoever’s deep in the company, still running the paperclip guy. I want to just say how see you,

[01:02:46] Christina: we see you. Well, look, look, they, when I first joined Microsoft, they had like almost a moratorium on even mentioning clippies name.

[01:02:53] Like they were very anti anything bringing up Clippy. And I would like to take a small role [01:03:00] in this. It, it was other people too, to be very clear, it was not me. Um, but I did play a small role in it, I think. And like basically kind of forcing the, the corporate marketing machine to recognize no, actually this nostalgia is good.

[01:03:15] You should embrace it. Like people will actually love exactly people love and miss Clippy. Um, uh, and, and one of the things like people don’t know, like internally. Uh, cause it doesn’t always come across, uh, with the corporate side, although they’ve been doing a better job is the company has a decent sense of humor about itself.

[01:03:35] Like in the, in the, uh, there’s a library on campus and they have like a hall of fame, you know, like famous products and things that they show off. And they also have like, um, a shelf of shame. They have like a wall of shame of like failed stuff. So they have like the unreleased version of Microsoft, Bob too.

[01:03:52] And like the, the, the kin phones and like some other stuff that just was like complete failures. And I don’t know, I, [01:04:00] I can’t like, I totally can’t see apple having like Newtons and Pippins on display, you know? So I, so, so there is like a certain amount of, of, of whimsy for that, but I just had an idea and I went through this by both of you.

[01:04:13] I love this so much that you’re wanting to show this gratitude. What if we all make a list in addition to thinking with five star reviews or on Twitter or making donations, however else we want to do it? What if we can make a list of stuff we’re grateful for? And next week, all three of us take turns and we share, and just give our own shout outs on this podcast, to the apps that that really help

[01:04:32] Jeff: us.

[01:04:32] I love

[01:04:33] it.

[01:04:33] Brett: be a regular corner.

[01:04:35] Jeff: I

[01:04:35] love it.

[01:04:35] Brett: could limit it. to like two per person per week and we could stretch it.

[01:04:39] out.

[01:04:41] Jeff: But next week’s going to be straight

[01:04:42] Christina: up Thanksgiving. Yeah, exactly. I think last, next week we just do straight up Thanksgiving and then we could make it a regular thing, but yeah. Are you guys into

[01:04:48] Jeff: that?

[01:04:48] Brett: Yeah.

[01:04:49] Jeff: I love it. I love it. And I can share whatever I learned from trying to get my gratitude into the right places.

[01:04:54] Yes.

[01:04:55] Brett: Perfect.

[01:04:56] Jeff: Awesome.

[01:04:57] Brett: Awesome. thanks you guys. [01:05:00]

[01:05:00] Jeff: Yeah. Yeah.

[01:05:01] Brett: I

[01:05:02] Jeff: Yeah.

[01:05:02] Brett: to tell you all about my discoveries, my revelations, as I tried to figure out the fuck is wrong with me, that I can’t like the BG, the BGS. I feel like it could, it’ll be, it’ll be a good portion of the episode, but it’ll be much more uplifting than my last attempt to convince everyone that the BGS were not a good band.

[01:05:23] Jeff: Alright. Alright. Alright. I look forward to it.

[01:05:27] Brett: All right. Hey, you guys get some sleep.

[01:05:29] Jeff: Yeah. You get some sleep. Get some sleep. See ya.