Overtired 271

[00:00:00] 20220129 1127 Guest: You’re listening to overtired. I’m Christina Warren. He’s Brett Terpstra Brett. How are you?

[00:00:09] 20220129 1127 Brett: Oh, my God. So good. How are you?

[00:00:13] 20220129 1127 Guest: I’m I’m pretty good. So It feels like it’s been forever since we talked,

[00:00:17] 20220129 1127 Brett: has been, it’s been a couple of weeks. We, uh, we had been recording on Saturday before the Friday we published and then we had a week off, but then we had a shitty week where we fell behind. Now we’re already recording Saturday the day after we were supposed to publish. So it’s been, it’s been a while.

[00:00:37] Yeah.

[00:00:38] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah.

[00:00:39] No, this is what happens like we were doing so well. We were like ahead of the game and, and

[00:00:45] 20220129 1127 Brett: had like days to edit.

[00:00:47] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah.

[00:00:47] I know in the. had like a thing last week and I didn’t really have a thing. I just, I was, so I was so tired. Like I genuinely was over tired. I was like tired of the point that I could not record.

[00:00:59] I [00:01:00] was like, I cannot do

[00:01:00] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. I picked up on that from your text messages. You’re very drowsy text messages.

[00:01:06] 20220129 1127 Guest: Like, when you can tell that when someone is tired in text,

[00:01:09] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. Yeah. And then we, we rescheduled for mid week and then I got sick, like too sick to sit at a desk. I didn’t actually take a sick day from work. I was able to from a supine position, uh, attend all of my meetings. And the weird thing about work right now is I, I can’t remember the last time we talked, but they, they switched my manager.

[00:01:36] I know we talked about that. They’ve assigned me to a bunch of projects that are basically. Not happening. Like there, there they are in, in corporate parlance blocked. And so while everyone assumes that I’m busy with like three projects at once, none of them are moving [00:02:00] and I’m doing my best to pick up like odd jobs from like, Hey, do you need help with this?

[00:02:06] I have some in again in corporate parlance, I have some cycles available. Um, I guess

[00:02:13] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh my

[00:02:14] 20220129 1127 Brett: that’s like tech world corporate parlance,

[00:02:17] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. Wow. Yep.

[00:02:19] 20220129 1127 Brett: yeah, so I’ll be honest. Despite two sick days, this last week was just fucking easy and I should, I honestly, there’s nothing I can do about it. It’s not like I’m being lazy.

[00:02:32] If, if, if my boss hears this, um, I’m doing exactly what I’m supposed to be doing.

[00:02:38] 20220129 1127 Guest: You are, you’re doing exactly what you’re supposed to do. And it’s like, you’re trying, like, it’s, it’s not your fault that your stuff is blocked.

[00:02:46] 20220129 1127 Brett: is a hundred percent not my fault.

[00:02:47] 20220129 1127 Guest: So, I mean, Like you have two options, you can continue to work on the blocked stuff that is blocked. And at a certain point

[00:02:55] 20220129 1127 Brett: there’s nothing I can do.

[00:02:56] 20220129 1127 Guest: do.

[00:02:56] Right.

[00:02:56] I was going to say like, at a certain point, you’re done like at a [00:03:00] certain point, like if there are blockers, like you can’t go any further. So if you’re not getting instruction to do more than that, and you are actively, which you are like reaching out and trying to get more things done, like, Yeah. I

[00:03:13] 20220129 1127 Brett: I’m being a good employee.

[00:03:14] 20220129 1127 Guest: you are like, it is not your fault that.

[00:03:17] It is bureaucratic as hell.

[00:03:19] 20220129 1127 Brett: So do you want to have a, a breadth mental health core?

[00:03:22] 20220129 1127 Guest: I do. Let’s have breast mental health corner.

[00:03:24] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. So right now I am, if not, if not stable, I’m coming out of a depression. And this last manic episode, I went through a couple of weeks ago now I decided I was done like, okay. So I decided the only difference between now and the last time I was consistently stable for more than a month was the Focalin, which is by far my favorite ADHD stimulant.

[00:03:59] It, [00:04:00] it, it works, it just works. And the last thing I was on was Vyvanse, which I’ve been on, on and off for 15 years. Um, and it’s not like after, after a year on it, it feels like it’s not doing anything at all, but. It also wasn’t causing mood swings. And I decided I made the decision. I’ve already contacted my doctor to go back to Vyvanse in the hopes of just finding some kind of workable stability.

[00:04:34] Maybe not as effective as I had been, but without the like, cause honestly manic episodes are productive for me for about a day and a half. And then at that point I’ve gone 36 hours without sleep.

[00:04:52] 20220129 1127 Guest: Right.

[00:04:53] 20220129 1127 Brett: how elevated my mood is or how much energy I have my work suffers. And then that’s [00:05:00] followed by one to three weeks of not wanting to leave the couch.

[00:05:05] That’s not productive as much as like, it feels like Focalin is the more effective choice. I, I don’t know, like I’ve considered maybe trying a new stimulant. Um, but I just, I just, I want the, I want the cycle of manic and depressive states to, to add.

[00:05:25] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. no, I mean, I think that’s important and I’m glad that you’re, you’re talking to your doctor about that because that is the thing, right? Like it’s, it’s one thing it’s like, okay, that’s awesome that, you know, you have the, that, um, what you may call it that like, Uh,

[00:05:39] the focal and seems to work so well, but if it’s not really working and it’s not like, okay, it makes you feel really focused, but you get, you get a couple of days everything being okay, then you have the one manic day where it’s good.

[00:05:51] And then you have like the rest of the manic cycle, which, puts you like awake too long, which isn’t helpful. And then you have like the depressive [00:06:00] cycle, which is not helpful for anyone. And then the Focalin is not helping.

[00:06:02] 20220129 1127 Brett: which grand total gives me like three actually productive days a month. That’s not, that’s not the sign of effectiveness.

[00:06:10] 20220129 1127 Guest: No, it’s not. So it’s like, okay, this, this, this technically better drug really. Isn’t better. That’s

[00:06:15] 20220129 1127 Brett: It just feels more like cocaine and I miss cocaine. I’ll be honest. Like it is very much an addict. It’s an addict making the decisions there. This, this drug feels better. Uh, Vyvanse feels nothing like cocaine. Five minutes almost doesn’t feel like anything to me, but, but I think that’s what I need. And I’m being a responsible adult and saying, let’s, let’s do that.

[00:06:43] Oh, thanks.

[00:06:44] 20220129 1127 Guest: uh, genuinely, like I’m really proud of you because that would be Yeah, Cause you know, and, and that is also like, you were like going against the whole laws of diminishing returns thing, right? Like you are like, actually you’re like recognizing like the sunk cost fallacy. You’re like, Nope. Not doing it. I’m really proud of you.

[00:06:59] 20220129 1127 Brett: cost [00:07:00] fallacy. That sounds like an economics term course sodas law of diminishing return. This is, this is giving me flashbacks to microeconomics, which I only pass because of the bell curve.

[00:07:11] 20220129 1127 Guest: again, a sunk cost fallacy is the idea where people think that the more like, because you’ve already invested so much money in something you’re going to continue to see it out and you put more money after it.

[00:07:21] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah.

[00:07:22] 20220129 1127 Guest: And, and so you, you wind up wasting more when you should’ve just like backed out, like.

[00:07:28] 20220129 1127 Brett: I had a meeting with my financial advisor this week. She, last time I talked to her, I was taking five grand out of my 401k. Because times were desperate. And I had, I felt no choice. And this time I’m like, oh, Hey, I have a $22,000 in savings. And all of my bills are covered. My credit card debt is paid off and she’s like, holy cow.

[00:07:57] I’m so proud of you, which is, [00:08:00] I guess, I guess that’s what I’m looking for in life. People to just be proud of me. Oh my God.

[00:08:06] 20220129 1127 Guest: awesome.

[00:08:07] 20220129 1127 Brett: Totally, totally aside. I did a talk about bunch to a Mac user groups out of Naples

[00:08:16] 20220129 1127 Guest: Nice. Like, like, like Naples, Italy, or Naples, Florida.

[00:08:20] 20220129 1127 Brett: I think Florida, I’m not even sure. I just know it was the Naples Mac user group. And they asked me to do another talk on tagging.

[00:08:29] And I’m kinda, I’m done talking about tagging. Like I’m still a big proponent of tagging, but I, I, I’m just tired of trying to convince people. So I was like, Hey, I have this project that I’m super into called bunch. Why don’t I talk about that? Not realizing, and I should have realized, but not realizing that the median age of this user group is about 110, which I think, which I think is par for like user groups these days.

[00:08:59] I [00:09:00] feel like people have other ways.

[00:09:02] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay. But I just look, this is also, this is in fact Naples, Florida. So this is retirement

[00:09:06] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah, for

[00:09:07] 20220129 1127 Guest: I like that, that, that, that is not like judgemental. Like that is like, gee, I wish I could be retired. Like I wish I could like be retired

[00:09:13] 20220129 1127 Brett: actually, I actually have relatives in Naples. Um, but so, so the zoom, uh, user group meeting starts with 140, 140 people. And by the time I’m done talking, they made me talk for an hour. And by the time I’m done talking, there are 70 people left. I lost half the crowd and the other half, they, I don’t think they meant to CC me on this, but they send out an apology for my talk afterward.

[00:09:47] like, Hey, we try to bring on people that you’ll be interested in, but we failed this time.

[00:09:53] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh, no, you got time.

[00:09:56] You, you, you, you, you got like, uh, Tanya museums.

[00:09:59] 20220129 1127 Brett: [00:10:00] Yeah. But they paid me a hundred dollars for the, for the talk, which I’ve never been paid for a, uh, a user group talk before.

[00:10:11] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah.

[00:10:11] 20220129 1127 Brett: So I was like, Hey, thanks for the a hundred dollars. I’m sorry that I bored 70 people enough to walk out.

[00:10:20] 20220129 1127 Guest: And another 70 who just didn’t know how to hit the end call button on

[00:10:24] 20220129 1127 Brett: I have gotten right. I got, I’ve gotten two people have followed up with me with, with bunch of questions. How do I make this work? So there were two people, one of them, an organizer, but two people who were interested enough to, to try it out.

[00:10:43] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay.

[00:10:43] 20220129 1127 Brett: So two out of 140 that’s, you know,

[00:10:48] 20220129 1127 Guest: I mean,

[00:10:48] 20220129 1127 Brett: not a great, what, what B RBA

[00:10:53] 20220129 1127 Guest: I mean, it’s pretty low, but it’s also considering the audience not awful. Now let me ask you this. [00:11:00] The organizer who sent you this stuff, is this the same organizer that also accidentally CC’d you on the appalling?

[00:11:05] 20220129 1127 Brett: it is.

[00:11:08] 20220129 1127 Guest: Uh, oh man, I’m not, I’m trying not to laugh the whole,

[00:11:16] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. Yeah, that was, that was my humor for the week.

[00:11:20] 20220129 1127 Guest: I mean,

[00:11:20] 20220129 1127 Brett: And oh my God. I stressed out because like, so in my head, I’m presenting this to a bunch of like people who will be interested. They’re like Mac, like automation, people who, who want like the latest and greatest and four weeks, I’m like, how am I going to fill an hour?

[00:11:39] Like I don’t, I never talk for an hour. I could never be a professor. I can’t fill an hour. So I ended up, I ended up like sitting down and practicing and just recording my practice and then editing multiple takes of my practice and then [00:12:00] just playing a video over zoom. So I didn’t have to. Stress about it.

[00:12:05] And then if, as like, so I was in chat while it was playing and as people ask questions, I could answer them in chat because I wasn’t talking. And it actually worked out really well, uh, and relieve some stress from me. But like I put, I put hours of stress into this meeting that ended up being apologized for, you know what, I’m sorry to, sorry, not sorry.

[00:12:33] I did my job. I did exactly what I said it was going to do

[00:12:36] 20220129 1127 Guest: No, you did. You, you, you did exactly what you said you were going to do. Look, I’m going to say this. I don’t think anybody can fault you for anything. The only thing you might be like, I would say, like to think about it in the future and I still I’m still at vaulting you, the only thing you might want to think about the future would be, think about Like your audience next time.

[00:12:52] 20220129 1127 Brett: well.

[00:12:53] 20220129 1127 Guest: more audience,

[00:12:54] 20220129 1127 Brett: I said, I didn’t understand what the audience was going to be. The rule [00:13:00] for me moving forward is just don’t do user group talks.

[00:13:04] 20220129 1127 Guest: No, I mean, I think you’re right. I think, I think that is a good rule. I, but I’m just saying, I think also in general, cause I’ve made this mistake before, too, where I understood in my mind The audience to be one thing and then realized when I got there that it was a completely different thing.

[00:13:18] 20220129 1127 Brett: worst part is I realized it about two days before and there was no going back.

[00:13:23] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh, man. I once realized in the room right before I gave my presentation.

[00:13:29] 20220129 1127 Brett: Oh, that would be a sinking feeling for

[00:13:31] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh, I mean, okay. So I was giving this talk that I was also paid for and I had written the presentation with one audience in mind, and then I realized it was a completely different audience and they were expecting a completely different type of talk.

[00:13:45] And I’m seeing the other person who was giving this presentation, who was from the MIT media lab. So of course he has the most beautiful presentation ever. Whereas mine is just some bullshit slide and I’m thinking to myself, I’m like, okay, do I need [00:14:00] to fake a seizure? Do I need to stand up like fall flat on my face and pass out?

[00:14:03] Like, what Do I need to do right now? Like, how am I going to get out of this? It ended up working out. I actually ended up getting another gig out of it, but it was one of the most stressful experiences of my life for sure.

[00:14:16] 20220129 1127 Brett: do you remember the TNG where, uh, Troy Picard and data were coming back from a symposium and they got stuck in these like time distortions and like, people would just like freeze and then they came back and the enterprise look appear to be under attack from a Romulan ship, but it was like frozen in time.

[00:14:40] 20220129 1127 Guest: I don’t, I don’t. we, but tell me more about this, because I

[00:14:43] 20220129 1127 Brett: it’s I, the reason I bring it up is they’re describing the symposium to each other and how one of the professors presenting thought the talk was about something entirely [00:15:00] different, but never paused enough for Picard to like, let them know that this isn’t what the symposium is about.

[00:15:08] He said it and he’d demonstrate he like did the run-on sentence with no stops so he could demonstrate how the guy was talking. And it was very hypnotic. I only bring this up because I literally just watched this episode this morning and it’s in my mind.

[00:15:23] 20220129 1127 Guest: No, but that’s also that’s, but it’s completely on point with what we’re talking about. That is, yup.

[00:15:27] 20220129 1127 Brett: weird, weird synchronicity. Huh?

[00:15:30] 20220129 1127 Guest: Well, seriously, genuinely. I was going, I’m also thinking, okay. I.

[00:15:34] and I admit, I mean, I, I don’t think I’ve ever seen all of TNG, but what I’ve seen of it, I quite liked, but I’m, it was, it was just a little bit before my time.

[00:15:43] 20220129 1127 Brett: You’re married to grant

[00:15:45] 20220129 1127 Guest: I know.

[00:15:46] 20220129 1127 Brett: isn’t grant like a big like star Trek guy. Or am I thinking of Scott McNulty?

[00:15:52] 20220129 1127 Guest: thinking it’s got.

[00:15:52] 20220129 1127 Brett: of Scott McNulty. Okay.

[00:15:55] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, no, no.

[00:15:56] 20220129 1127 Brett: I, you would not get away with that with Scott

[00:15:59] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh, [00:16:00] absolutely not. McNulty

[00:16:01] Like who several S T and G and star Trek podcast. No, I was going to say I was like grid, snap, a Trekker or whatever they call them, um, selves. Um, because apparently Trekkie’s a slur. Well, no, no. I think Trekkie’s a slur.

[00:16:12] I think they really call themselves trekkers, let us know in the discord. I don’t know. Um,

[00:16:18] 20220129 1127 Brett: how I don’t understand how it could be a slur.

[00:16:20] 20220129 1127 Guest: don’t think it’s really a slur. I just think that

[00:16:22] 20220129 1127 Brett: think they’re all slurs, depending on which side you’re coming at her from

[00:16:25] 20220129 1127 Guest: I mean, I think

[00:16:26] 20220129 1127 Brett: can like one, one Trekkie can call another Trekkie, a Trekkie.

[00:16:30] 20220129 1127 Guest: well, yeah, I mean, I, but I think it’s one of those things where people are like, oh, we’re not really Trekkies like that. That’s just what the media calls

[00:16:37] 20220129 1127 Brett: We also like star wars people forget that you can like both

[00:16:42] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. Um, so apparently there is like, when I, when I looked at Trekkie versus Trekker, there is like a, uh, There’s a whole Wikipedia. There, there are whole like blog posts about this. So,

[00:16:55] 20220129 1127 Brett: I’m to, I’m going to Google that for the show notes.

[00:16:58] 20220129 1127 Guest: yeah. Yeah. I was going to say [00:17:00] it at the star Trek at the memory. Alpha Wiki is got a hole anyway. Um, but what I was going to say, I’m like, well, not like a huge truck personally.

[00:17:08] I’ve always enjoyed what I’ve seen, but I love that they had like, honestly, when we’re going to be talking about TV in a little bit, but I love that they have like a pretty banal episode, but you know what I mean? Like in terms of a topic, like, that’s like a kind of a, sit-com like, sort of like thing of like, you know, guy like talks like, so monotone so long, you can’t interrupt him.

[00:17:28] Like that’s like a pretty traditional trope. I love, they just kind of inserted that in decipher. That’s

[00:17:32] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah, it, and it got more interesting, but I will say that, and this will come up again in the future, but my girlfriend was relatively recently diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder. And like, and I’ll say at the top, just about all the things I most respect and love about her are symptoms of [00:18:00] autism. So it’s a good pairing, but she also gets easily overwhelmed.

[00:18:06] And, uh, the most relaxing show we can watch is star Trek, TNG. And we are almost to the last season. So we’ll be moving into, we’ve been doing this from, we’d been watching a chronological order from, uh, enterprise through original series through TNG, and we’re going to hit, uh,

[00:18:30] 20220129 1127 Guest: I guess we’ll go to Voyager.

[00:18:31] 20220129 1127 Brett: No, no, no, no. When we started deep space nine, because they coincided and they crossed timelines.

[00:18:38] So we’re also watching deep space nine and then Voyager, which I’m looking forward to getting to, because I’ve never seen Voyager.

[00:18:46] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay. And like people that I like, like, and respect really like

[00:18:50] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. Yes. Got McNaulty top of the top of the pile there, uh, had like talks about Voyager. Like it was the [00:19:00] best and I’ve seen all of T and G before. So this is like review for both me and Al, but we are both looking forward to getting to Voyager after, after all the things we’ve heard retroactively.

[00:19:13] 20220129 1127 Guest: yeah. Um, I was going to say, I mean, Voyager was the one that was the one that was on UPN, right?

[00:19:18] 20220129 1127 Brett: I don’t

[00:19:19] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yes, it was. Yeah, it was, I mean, I didn’t need, I was just trying to think of my head. Yeah. it.

[00:19:23] ended in 2001. Um, yeah, that, that, uh, Alex, Cranz my good friend. She, she likes so

[00:19:34] 20220129 1127 Brett: Which which, okay. So I know I want to come back to this, but have you seen star Trek discovery?

[00:19:41] 20220129 1127 Guest: yes, I have.

[00:19:42] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. We’re going to talk about that more towards the end of the show in the meantime, last tech TA. No, not last tech type. I have, I have a slew of tech topics, but, um, I, okay. So I, I wrote all these tests [00:20:00] for my little command line utility doing, and they’re not unit tests.

[00:20:06] They’re really integration tests and the entire test suite, if you run it in cereal takes about three minutes to complete 279 tests. I’ve written. But I figured out I got better at Ruby and I figured out how to run them in parallel. Uh, so I’ve got it down to about 70 seconds and I built it so that it pops up like a tree view with check boxes and as the tasks complete, it fills him in with a check box and then starts more tests.

[00:20:46] So it’s only running so many tests in parallel at once. And as each one finishes, it adds a new thread. It’s beautiful. We don’t need to talk about it extensively. I’m just very proud of it.

[00:20:58] 20220129 1127 Guest: That’s pretty great. [00:21:00]

[00:21:00] 20220129 1127 Brett: I should show you. I should show you, um, how hard would it be for me to share my screen over Skype? Yeah, I’ll I’ll do this another time. It’s beautiful though. It’s really cool. Looking. I used a Ruby lot, a Ruby library called T T Y a TTY. Progress bar, maybe. I don’t know, but it’s all, it’s all part of this Ruby library called TTY and

[00:21:26] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh, I’m seeing, oh, I’m seeing this as a TTY toolkit. Um, okay. Okay. This is, this goes on my list because I’ve recently become obsessed with like Tys and I found like, um, there’s, uh, there’s rich, which is a Python one, and there’s a spectrum console, which is a, uh, a C-sharp one. And there is, um, uh, charm, which is actually very cool, which is like Elm.

[00:21:54] Um, and uh, now I know about a TTY [00:22:00] toolkit, which is Ruby.

[00:22:01] 20220129 1127 Brett: I was reading an article about what programming languages not to learn and what to learn instead. And it started off strong. Like don’t learn objective C, learn swift, make sense. Like number three, they got to don’t learn HTML, CSS learned JavaScript instead, which I feel like you cannot create. Even, you cannot create a react application without understanding HTML and CSS.

[00:22:32] 20220129 1127 Guest: Correct.

[00:22:33] 20220129 1127 Brett: If for any web developer, for anyone who would have a need for any of these languages, uh, a basic understanding of HTML and CSS, absolutely vital. Like, I don’t understand how you would skip over and just learn JavaScript.

[00:22:51] 20220129 1127 Guest: We’ll wait. And it’s weird. I mean, I guess like tailwinds is, You, know, one of the things that I guess people do, um, you know, I don’t know how familiar you, are with, with, with the [00:23:00] tailwind CSS. Um,

[00:23:02] 20220129 1127 Brett: you act. I believe we’d want that before.

[00:23:04] 20220129 1127 Guest: yeah. Um, I mean, cause that basically kind of lets you, you know, build, Um,

[00:23:09] although you do use HTML with it, but it is kind of the, the way that it works is that it has a lot of components to make some of the CSS aspects step a little bit easier, but you still need to have an understanding of, of what you’re doing.

[00:23:24] You know, it just, it just maybe makes it a little more, you know, like react like, um, and, and, um, a little more modular and some of your layout stuff. I, yeah, that’s such a weird that, like, you know what that reads to me that reads to me like that was an article that was written by someone who’s never programmed anything.

[00:23:40] 20220129 1127 Brett: it, it read to me like someone who was reading an article to get clicks. They suggested that instead of learning C you learn Ruby, I can understand, not learning. See, like, I feel

[00:23:53] 20220129 1127 Guest: but then you would you, but then you would learn, go

[00:23:55] 20220129 1127 Brett: right. Or rust. Exactly, exactly. [00:24:00] Like nobody at this point. And, and this is coming from a guy who. Lives in Ruby. Nobody at this point should be learning Ruby instead of something else.

[00:24:12] Ruby is, as far as I can tell a dead language, like as far as the modern sands of time, Ruby is not what anyone should be learning. You would be better off learning C than Ruby that said, yeah, learn Russ, learn scaler, like learn something like currently vital.

[00:24:35] 20220129 1127 Guest: No, totally learn, learn, learn, go. Which was. Created in part to replace C you know, I mean like, um, uh, obviously I think Russ would be better. I agree with you if, if we’re just talking about those things, but also, I mean, in general, cause people always ask this question. My answers are usually JavaScript and Python for like, you know, just most, you know, maximum viability, but learn what the team that you’re working on or [00:25:00] the project that you’re like doing needs, you know, like learn one and then adapt based on, on, on what the team you’re working on is.

[00:25:09] 20220129 1127 Brett: I have a friend, Jesse Atkinson, great guy almost hired him for AOL. Like we did hire him and then they fucking change the rules on us. But anyway, he got his current job with a dedication to learn a language. He didn’t know, he basically signed up for a job. I think it was scaler that he, he, he hadn’t used before, but he was determined to learn.

[00:25:38] So he, he applied for a job that required that language and he got the job

[00:25:46] 20220129 1127 Guest: Wow.

[00:25:47] 20220129 1127 Brett: and, and he learned the language. That is, yes, that is the sign of a young program.

[00:25:54] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. I was going to say that well, that is decided like somebody like young, some news the time somebody who like the, the still has [00:26:00] like the love and isn’t like

[00:26:01] 20220129 1127 Brett: And the brain plasticity. I, I worry in my older age that I won’t be able to continue learning new languages.

[00:26:10] 20220129 1127 Guest: Uh, I think you will.

[00:26:11] 20220129 1127 Brett: I hope

[00:26:12] 20220129 1127 Guest: you will. I mean, again, I mean, again, like, like I, I think that when you look at, um, yeah, like I think that a lot of times people think, oh, well, you know, you get older, you, you can’t learn new things and whatnot. I don’t think it’s you can’t. I think that is about mindset. It’s like, do you want to, or not?

[00:26:29] I think that it’s a lot of people who for very good reasons are like, I have too many other things going on and I don’t want to go through all this again, you know, but, but some people like me and I think you’re the same way. I actually enjoy learning new things.

[00:26:43] 20220129 1127 Brett: Well, sure. Yeah. Like, and to be fair, I have learned more about Ruby in the last year than I’ve known in 20 years of using it. And like, it’s fascinating to me to learn. Like, I didn’t know how to use Proxin Lambdas [00:27:00] until this year. And I’ve been using Ruby since 2000, so like I enjoy learning new things and I enjoy learning new languages to see how they handle the same thing.

[00:27:15] But I do feel like I’m hitting like a diminishing returns.

[00:27:21] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. I mean, you might be hitting the diminishing returns.

[00:27:23] thing. That’s not quite the same thing. And I will say this and obviously, you know, Ken Thompson is like the goat and it is a very unique case, but he’s like 80 or almost 80. And, and he, you know, was one of the creators of, of go as well. Right. So, which means that he was creating that.

[00:27:44] A decade old. So like, you know, when he was working on it in his seventies,

[00:27:49] 20220129 1127 Brett: Wait go is a decade old.

[00:27:51] 20220129 1127 Guest: I think so,

[00:27:52] 20220129 1127 Brett: feel like I just heard about goat go about three years ago.

[00:27:56] 20220129 1127 Guest: uh, first appeared November 10th, 2009. Yeah.

[00:27:59] 20220129 1127 Brett: [00:28:00] Damn I, somebody is not keeping up with shit.

[00:28:04] 20220129 1127 Guest: So, so like, I’m just saying like, so, so he was clearly, he was like, because he had been working on it, you know, at, you know, Google cause he co-developed the, the programming language. So, uh, into his seventies, I don’t know. That’s pretty exciting to me, just That somebody, you know what I mean? Like, like that, even if we all can’t be Ken Thompson’s like, cause of course we can’t, but that’s one of those things that like excites me Cause I’m like, shit, dude, like this guy is still doing it. Like our, our, our, our, our, our Unix godfather is still fucking creating stuff, you know?

[00:28:34] 20220129 1127 Brett: hope.

[00:28:35] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. So I have I’ve I’ve absolutely no. No doubt that like, as long as you want to continue learning and, and, um, getting better at things, you will, I’ve no doubt about that at all.

[00:28:46] 20220129 1127 Brett: All right. Last tech topic, before we get to some, some great TV.

[00:28:51] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yes.

[00:28:53] 20220129 1127 Brett: I, so I needed to install a certain or Oracle application on [00:29:00] my Mac mini. To be able to do my job. So I, in order to do so I had to install, um, they’re kind of like it’s called my desktop and it is the interface through which you install Oracle software.

[00:29:18] I installed it. I installed the one piece of software I needed eventually had to do a reboot as we’ve talked about before on my Mac mini. And it came up with a lock screen that said, this machine is the property of Oracle. And I said, no. And I immediately uninstalled all that shit. And I cannot figure out how to change my lock screen.

[00:29:42] But now, now I’m getting non-compliance warnings from Oracle saying this machine does not have like whatever antivirus software installed.

[00:29:54] 20220129 1127 Guest: right.

[00:29:55] 20220129 1127 Brett: If I go to remove the machine from my [00:30:00] Oracle registered personal machines, it wants me to return the machine to Oracle. Like it wants to print out a fucking RMA for me to return my personal computer, to my employer who did not buy my personal

[00:30:16] 20220129 1127 Guest: right. Because you installed something on it. Nan MDMs are so screwed. Have you figured out any solution for this

[00:30:23] 20220129 1127 Brett: I, well, my solution was to ignore it. And then my manager said, Hey, I’m getting notifications that you have a non-compliant machine. And to be like, I don’t need to run any Oracle software to do my job. And if I could just unregistered. I, I would be done. Like I don’t need their software to do my job.

[00:30:53] And I have an Oracle laptop that works for accessing everything I need [00:31:00] to from their machine that I will happily return to them if the time comes. I, I don’t, I know, I don’t know what to do. I have to go through tech support.

[00:31:12] 20220129 1127 Guest: was going to say, you probably have to unfortunately file a ticket and conduct tech support. I had a similar issue. It was different and my manager certainly wasn’t involved, but I accidentally. When I had that Dell laptop for like two

[00:31:25] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:31:26] 20220129 1127 Guest: I accidentally provisioned it as a work device, which means that in the MDM, it shows up as like a work owned machine.

[00:31:35] And then I can’t remove it because it shows that it’s belong to Microsoft. And clearly it wasn’t, it was my own personal thing. So it was, I’m not getting any sort of, I mean, and not using the device. So like it’s not giving me any, you know, um, uh, stuff or whatnot, but like, I don’t have the machine anymore, but it’s still in my account.

[00:31:51] So I have to file a ticket and follow up. I did file a ticket and then I just didn’t follow up on it. Cause I didn’t want, I didn’t care, um, to like get them to manually remove [00:32:00] it. But I imagine that you’ll have to go through a similar tech support song and dance where you’ll have to reach out to tech support, file a ticket, and they will have to manually remove the machine from, you know, the database, uh, no pun intended there, Oracle, uh, so that you don’t get those so that you don’t get those, uh, messages.

[00:32:23] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. Anyway, you know, what would be a good transition between like tech talk and TV talk

[00:32:32] 20220129 1127 Guest: uh, Zoc doc,

[00:32:33] 20220129 1127 Brett: a sponsor break. Yeah.

[00:32:35] 20220129 1127 Guest: I think so. I think so. All right. So while you’re a kind of a, you know, we were talking about mental health, we were talking about a Brett you’re feeling a little bit down now, or think we’re going to talk about some of the TV you watched while you were feeling down. If you’re, uh, needing a doctor Zoc doc is for you.

[00:32:53] So has this ever happened to you before? Uh, you need to see a. And you’re searching to find one that looks good. [00:33:00] You’re waiting on hold to book the appointment, you’re rearranging your schedule. And then you finally go to the doctor and it turns out they don’t take your insurance, which is completely frustrating, but there is a solution just download the free Zoc doc app, the easiest way to find a great doctor and instantly book an appointment.

[00:33:20] So with doc doc, you can search for local doctors who take your insurance, which is key. You can read, verify patient reviews, book an appointment. You can do in-person or video chat, which is really handy. And you never have to wait on hold with the receptionist. Again, I have used Zoc doc for more than a decade. Yeah.

[00:33:36] Far and away my favorite place, uh, to find a doctor, especially with different specialties. If you’re like looking for a primary care physician or a dentist or dermatologist or an eye doctor or something else, Zoc doc has you covered. And like I said, you can know instantly when you’re booking the appointment, which you’re booking in the app that they take your insurance, which is great.

[00:33:56] So go to Zoc doc.com/overtired [00:34:00] and download the Zoc doc app for signup, uh, or to sign up for free every month. Millions of people use doc doc. I’m one of them, as I said, it is my go-to. Whenever I need to see the doctor Zoc doc makes health care easy. So now it’s time to prioritize your health new year go-to Zoc doc.com/ over-tired and download these doc doc app to sign up for a free sign up for free and book a top rated doctor many are available as soon as today, that is Z O C doc.com/.

[00:34:34] 20220129 1127 Brett: That’s a fantastic read, Christina.

[00:34:37] 20220129 1127 Guest: Thank you, Brett. Appreciate it fell a little rusty, but I felt like I was coming back into it.

[00:34:41] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah.

[00:34:41] 20220129 1127 Guest: So, uh,

[00:34:43] 20220129 1127 Brett: a couple of weeks

[00:34:43] 20220129 1127 Guest: after couple weeks off,

[00:34:44] Yeah, no, it’s good. Um, so we were texting before our various like, delays about TV and I’m like looking at your list and we’ve got a, I’m very excited this cause we have a lot of TV to talk about.

[00:34:56] So where do you wanna start?

[00:34:58] 20220129 1127 Brett: so, okay. First of [00:35:00] all, queer query.

[00:35:01] 20220129 1127 Guest: So.

[00:35:02] 20220129 1127 Brett: It is. And season six, I like the latest season. I found that going through it. Uh, we were constantly pausing because it brought up conversation topics, and we’d pause. And we talk about these things that had happened to us or that we thought, or that we believed. And, and then continue on with the show and it became this super interactive TV for us.

[00:35:30] We finished season six and we’re like, well, shit, that was great. Let’s go back in the catalog. Season five has not seemed to have that same effect. I feel like season six is, is exceptional and better than preceding seasons. Have you watched enough

[00:35:55] 20220129 1127 Guest: I have, I have an, I don’t know, I do feel like season six was the best. I [00:36:00] don’t know. It’s like So much better. I feel like sometimes these shows do kind of ebb and flow based on, you know, the casting and, and like the, you know, the, the make-over contestants and stuff, you know, that they can choose and pick.

[00:36:13] Um, and I feel like everybody really jelled with season six, I did feel like the first season was really strong.

[00:36:19] 20220129 1127 Brett: in season. Okay. I will go back to the first season in season five. They go and make over a New Jersey, like a Jersey shore DJ. And I cannot give a fuck about that. I didn’t even, I got about 15 minutes into the episode and I just did not care. Season six, I cared about just about every episode. I’m like, yes, I want to see this person’s transformation.

[00:36:51] I want to see where it goes. I don’t care about Jersey shore, DJ. I just don’t.[00:37:00]

[00:37:00] 20220129 1127 Guest: No. And, well, that’s the thing, Right, Is that it’s difficult. Like the first season was all Atlanta or it was all Georgia, I guess. And like, um, the first couple of seasons where I guess, cause they were, you know, they got the tax credits there. And so, uh, so, so that, um, uh, I was just hysterical that my home state has become like, everything is filmed in Georgia and I see stuff and I’m like, that’s not fucking wherever that’s Georgia.

[00:37:22] And I’m just like, God damn like, and it’s funny too, because it all really started right.

[00:37:27] after I left. And I used to have like good contacts with the film and television, like commission there. And uh, and, and so I’m still on some of their press listings. And like it got when I had to like unsubscribe or create a filter or something because the number of project emails that I was getting like alerts for stuff like filming, cause it back in the day it was.

[00:37:45] A big deal of like one or two things were phone there. And then it was like the entire industry mood we

[00:37:50] 20220129 1127 Brett: And then you’re like, that’s not Paris. That’s Savannah,

[00:37:53] 20220129 1127 Guest: exactly, exactly. Like that is not terrorist. That is, that is, that is Savannah. Yeah. Or you see others, [00:38:00] like, like that’s not Los Angeles. What the fuck are you even talking about? That’s like, that’s 85.

[00:38:06] That’s not the 4 0 5. That’s 85.

[00:38:08] 20220129 1127 Brett: Hey, if that’s what it takes to get a good film made. That’s one thing I’m cool with it.

[00:38:13] 20220129 1127 Guest: I agree. In many cases, I think they’re just people being cheap asses. Um, uh, although again, and I’ve said this before mad, mad props to, uh, Tyler Perry, who has been the one who’s beat out the best in all of this by owning all the fucking studios and renting them out to people like you go like the house that Medea built, like grant a grant, loves those movies.

[00:38:35] And, and even he doesn’t know why cause they’re terrible, but we love Tyler Perry. And, uh, and, and like, I’m very proud of Tyler Perry anyway. Um, But this is a good point because with these shows, I agree with, I think season six, you care a lot, but this is a good show. Like obviously the cast on queer eye is great, but this points out casting is so important for these other types of reality shows.

[00:38:56] Like you have to have really compelling people [00:39:00] and that’s hard to do because sometimes you really nail it. And sometimes you, you don’t, you know, and so, um, I, okay. This is not a good show. Like queer eye is genuinely a good show for anybody in the audience listening. Like it’s honestly, it’s genuinely heartwarming and it’s a good show.

[00:39:14] Like it’s that the cast is great. We’ve talked about it before. Like it’s one of those things that makes you feel good about humanity. And in at least in my opinion, like as like queer eye in like Ted lasso or like the things that give me hope in this world. Um, but. Uh, a show that the polar opposite of this, except that it’s also very dependent on casting in terms of my enjoyment is 90 day fiance, which is a complete trash heap of just trash, but there are some seasons and some casts, some couples that are better than others.

[00:39:43] Um, how familiar are you with 90 day fiance?

[00:39:46] 20220129 1127 Brett: Absolutely. Let’s see what, what is zero minus zero?

[00:39:52] 20220129 1127 Guest: So the premise is, and you would hate this show, uh, uh, you, you would absolutely hate it.

[00:39:57] 20220129 1127 Brett: has always been my assumption.

[00:39:59] 20220129 1127 Guest: Uh, but, [00:40:00] uh, but there are things that grant and I quite enjoy it. Uh, it, it, it, it, it’s no love after lockup, but it, well, actually, in some cases it’s better, but which is another parable trash show. The whole idea is that there are like these, they there’s a provision where if you marry someone who’s from another country, they can get a provisional, like visa to become, you know, to get into the United States.

[00:40:23] Um, GreenGuard basically, so that the, basically the promise of the show is these are people who’ve met online. Usually. Um, sometimes they’ve met on vacation, other places, they have 90 days to get married, cause the person can be in the United States for 90 days. And then they got to get married and it like Chronicles their whole process of, of oftentimes like the, the interesting ones are really like the, we met on vacation and we were totally in love.

[00:40:46] And then now we’re actually living together and this person’s in a completely different country and we hate each other. Um, those are interesting.

[00:40:53] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah. I could see this premise going either way

[00:40:55] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. And, and then also sometimes the, the, the premise is like, oh, [00:41:00] she’s a straight up like, uh, like, like, um, w what what’s, what’s the term, um, uh, catalog, like, like white, you know what I mean?

[00:41:07] Like, I like you straight up, like, paid for this person, male. Thank you. Thank you. This is a straight middle order relationship, right? Like there’s some of those cases where like the woman, cause it is usually a woman who is not exclusively, but, but usually, um, sometimes you have, you have men too, but, but it’s, it’s primarily women.

[00:41:25] Um, just because of the nature of how this thing works, um, who are like straight up grifting, these dudes, um, and like clearly just want to get in the car. Um, but you’re not totally sympathetic to the dudes. Cause the dudes oftentimes are just as terrible. Like they clearly like, just like, couldn’t find anyone in the United States to fuck them.

[00:41:43] So they had to like do a mail order.

[00:41:46] thing and then expect, oh, because I’m bringing into this country, like you should really like me. And you know, a lot of times when we’re like, no, and then you have sometimes the really fun cases where like, you have actually feel bad for the people from out of the [00:42:00] country because they’ve been completely misled.

[00:42:01] Like there’s this one season where there’s this guy who, um, she actually had a really nice life in the Philippines. Like her parents were pretty well off and like she had things going on and um, he made himself out to be like, he had his shit together and had all these businesses and he was, you know, it is in his fifties I think.

[00:42:20] And, and like wealthy, no, uh, dude lives with his, uh, adult daughter in like a two bedroom, like a rundown apartment. And they have to live together because he relies on her for rent. It’s not one of those things where he’s like supporting her. Like he needs her half of the rent to be able to like live and like, you know, uh, completely misled this woman about like what his lifestyle was.

[00:42:46] And then she like gets to the United States and she’s like, I’m sorry, what? Like, so, so, um, so it can be really compelling, but the thing is, is that it’s all about the cast. It’s all about like, who are the people, the bachelors the same way. Like, it really all [00:43:00] depends on like how good of a Abbott cast you have and how much do you care about their stories?

[00:43:04] And so I agree with what you’re saying. Like, I haven’t watched season five of, of queer eye in a while. Um, I’ll have to go back, but, um, cause it was, it was 2020, and that was just, I mean that whole year is a blur, but, um, and it was like 18 months between seasons. Um, so, um, I, but yeah, I, uh,

[00:43:27] 20220129 1127 Brett: of cast though. Okay. So I know almost everybody’s name on query at this point, at least current cast members,

[00:43:37] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yes,

[00:43:38] 20220129 1127 Brett: but I do not know the non-binary persons name,

[00:43:43] 20220129 1127 Guest: Jonathan van ness.

[00:43:44] 20220129 1127 Brett: Jonathan,

[00:43:46] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah.

[00:43:47] 20220129 1127 Brett: out of like no member of that cast makes me feel weird except for Jonathan and season five of Jonathan does not make me feel weird.

[00:43:59] And this [00:44:00] is like, I’m, I’m, I’m exploring my own prejudices here,

[00:44:05] 20220129 1127 Guest: Right,

[00:44:05] 20220129 1127 Brett: but season six, they start wearing boxy dresses.

[00:44:12] 20220129 1127 Guest: right. Well, I think that, that was when they came out as non-binary.

[00:44:19] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. It’s something about that. Boxy dress causes weird feelings in me, and I can not explain them. Like they’re weird feelings that border on what they’re just confusion. Like I want that person to be in like pre prior to that they were wearing like crop tops. And, and that was that didn’t, that didn’t cause any reaction in me, something about the boxy dresses causes weird reactions to me and I can not explain them.

[00:44:53] And they, I it’s uncomfortable feeling like there must be something bigoted [00:45:00] about how I’m feeling. But to be fair, a woman or a man in that same dress would also make me uncomfortable. I don’t, I think I’m bigoted against boxy dresses.

[00:45:15] 20220129 1127 Guest: was going to say, I think maybe you just don’t like what they’re wearing, like, which is, which is fair. Like maybe you just like, like, and maybe the person you’re really mad at. Um, and I was wrong on this. I want, I, I want to crack this cause I’m Googling in real time. Uh, um, uh, Jonathan Mendez came out as nonbinary in 2019.

[00:45:31] So, um, earlier in this show is run. So, um, but maybe like, you’re just like bigoted towards like the costume designer, right? Like you just don’t like what they chose to wear, which is fair. I mean, like, honestly, that’s also the mark of, I mean, Cause sometimes. And here’s the thing too. I know that, that the, the, the, the fab five, like, are supposed to be known for, you know, their, their fashion sense and whatnot, but not everybody gets it right.

[00:45:56] All the time. Also, I’ve known plenty of, um, [00:46:00] stylists who have fantastic style for others, but my personal opinion is that they look like hot, garbage. Like, I don’t like the things they wear. I will, I will, I will say this. I’m going to get so much shit for this, but the most famous, um, um, like, uh, like costume designer, I think probably living today is, uh, Patricia field and Patricia field has fantastic style.

[00:46:23] So, so she does, she, she, Okay.

[00:46:25] So she did the costumes and the clothing for the original.

[00:46:30] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay,

[00:46:31] 20220129 1127 Guest: Um, and which is, you know, like was just fabulous. Uh, even when people would be like, what does Carrie wearing? You were talking about what Carrie was wearing. She’s not doing it on the revival because she’s doing Emily and Paris.

[00:46:43] Um, and Emily in Paris also has very good clothes. Um, and so I, um,

[00:46:49] 20220129 1127 Brett: which is, which is ironic because that show is basically designed for reading or phone while watching

[00:46:55] 20220129 1127 Guest: 1000% it is completely designed for that, but the clothes there are great. [00:47:00] And, and she does a great job with it. And, and Darren star who created both sex and city and Emily and Paris, but anyway, um, and Patricia field had like a very famous store in New York, uh, that, uh, no longer existed. I think by the time I was there, but like was very famous in the nineties is like the cool spot anyway, like her fashion sense and the way that she styles that is impeccable.

[00:47:20] But when I look at what she personally wears. I don’t, I, I’m not a fan. Like, I’m not going to say it’s like complete garbage, but it’s just like, I’m not a fan. So, so maybe that’s, so sometimes I feel like even if that is your own thing, so, so my whole thing is like, I would want a different costumer or stylist for Patricia field.

[00:47:38] If I were to see her like acting as

[00:47:42] 20220129 1127 Brett: Well, yeah, like Jonathan, Jonathan needs someone to do their

[00:47:46] 20220129 1127 Guest: that’s what I’m saying, that’s what I’m saying. They need someone to, to, to do their styling. Right. Um, actually, okay. The more I’m thinking about this, Patricia feels probably a bad example. She’s so eclectic. I probably wouldn’t want to style her, but I can say I’m not a fan of what she wears, [00:48:00] but, um, but, but there is a weird disconnect is like, I would see like what she would wear and then you see what she styles and know.

[00:48:06] This doesn’t correlate. Right. Um, which is fair, right? Because like, that’s like what you might personally want to do something with like, not everybody is going to be completely on it. You know what I mean? But, but that, Yeah,

[00:48:17] so I think you just have a thing against, uh, whoever is styling and costuming, uh, Jonathan, um, rather than, than, than being, you know, like an NB phobe,

[00:48:27] 20220129 1127 Brett: that makes me feel better because I have, I have, I am more nonbinary friends than I have trans friends and it, it has, it has blown me away. How many trans friends I have, how many people that I knew one way had become another way. And like, that is better. It’s honestly, it’s been exciting to see people becoming them, their true selves.

[00:48:54] And I have never had a problem with someone calling themselves non-binary because like, [00:49:00] I can relate, I get it. Like, I I’ve been beaten up for not being male enough. And I like, I have associated with female characteristics enough that I get how you could say, I don’t want to be either. I am, I am neither of these things.

[00:49:19] I don’t associate strongly with one or the other and it’s made me feel really weird to be so annoyed by Jonathan’s character.

[00:49:32] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah. I think, I think you, you just don’t like what they’re wearing

[00:49:35] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah.

[00:49:36] 20220129 1127 Guest: also, Jonathan, Jonathan, at this point is probably the most famous, so I would have to

[00:49:42] 20220129 1127 Brett: tan would be the most famous

[00:49:44] 20220129 1127 Guest: no, I mean, in terms of he is awesome.

[00:49:46] but I’m talking like in terms of pop culture, I’m talking, I’m talking in terms of like, like, like outside of like this.

[00:49:53] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay.

[00:49:54] 20220129 1127 Guest: Like Jonathan was in a Taylor swift video.

[00:49:56] 20220129 1127 Brett: Really? Which video?

[00:49:59] 20220129 1127 Guest: You need to [00:50:00] calm down the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, uh, the queer Anthem.

[00:50:04] 20220129 1127 Brett: I will admit I’ve never seen this video, so I’m going to add that to the show notes and then go look at it.

[00:50:10] 20220129 1127 Guest: it’s not my favorite. Um, but, uh, a lot of people were really into it, but, but, um, uh, there are some, um, some, um, um, some drag Queens in it, too. Um, um, um, Todrick hall, who’s her, uh, her who’s, her gay BFF is in it.

[00:50:24] Um, it’s a, it also includes like at the end, a reconciliation with her and Katy Perry, is interesting. Anyway, um, you can watch it, like, there’s some interesting things, like it’s very campy, it’s a very, very campy video. Um, I’ll be honest. It’s really a Kacey Musgraves video done by Taylor swift, which is weird, but it, it, um, that whole album lover is, uh, Especially now that we’ve had like the trifecta of folklore evermore and the red rereleased, I realized there was a fearless [00:51:00] rerelease in between those things in that mix too.

[00:51:03] But I’m not talking about that right now. When we have like that trifecta of like three, like perfect albums. I, we talked about how we were going to do a ranking of Taylor swift albums, uh, not going to do it.

[00:51:13] now, but, but I think about it, like, I really liked lover when it came out and there are still some songs on it that are high on my list. What it given, like what we got after. I, it, that that’s I think it’s, I, yeah, I think it’s one of her weaker ones. I have to say, even though some of the individual songs are really good. Yeah.

[00:51:35] 20220129 1127 Brett: You’d be amazed how much I don’t care,

[00:51:38] 20220129 1127 Guest: I know. I know you don’t, but.

[00:51:40] but like, but, but, but, but, but folklore, evermore, like the red rerelease, all good shit.

[00:51:47] And you liked both folklore and evermore.

[00:51:49] 20220129 1127 Brett: It’s it’s true. I liked, uh, shit. Okay. I’ve already forgotten the name of like every Taylor swift album.

[00:51:59] 20220129 1127 Guest: [00:52:00] Totally,

[00:52:00] 20220129 1127 Brett: What was the first one? She recorded

[00:52:03] 20220129 1127 Guest: uh, fearless.

[00:52:04] 20220129 1127 Brett: fearless. I liked fearless.

[00:52:06] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yeah, that’s a good album. It’s a good album. Um,

[00:52:10] 20220129 1127 Brett: version

[00:52:11] 20220129 1127 Guest: yes.

[00:52:12] 20220129 1127 Brett: because I support the idea of, of sticking it to big machine and whatever came after.

[00:52:18] 20220129 1127 Guest: Yup, yup. Yup. Fuck those guys. Totally. Okay. Anyway, All right.

[00:52:24] 20220129 1127 Brett: I got to mention one show before we get to some, both good and bad TV.

[00:52:30] Oh shit. We only have eight minutes left.

[00:52:32] 20220129 1127 Guest: we can go a little long.

[00:52:33] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. Um, there’s this

[00:52:37] 20220129 1127 Guest: been a few weeks. Let’s just go along.

[00:52:38] 20220129 1127 Brett: there’s a show called the dark side of the nineties, narrated by mark McGrath, which adds up. I’m not going to lie. Like I wouldn’t have chosen him, but if I was going to do a show about the dark side of the nineties, I would choose mark McGrath.

[00:52:57] And during my little sick [00:53:00] days last week, I watched a few episodes. Oh my God.

[00:53:05] 20220129 1127 Guest: I would still fuck him. I’m sorry. The sugar Ray guy is still really hot. Um, and look, if it looks, if any, I’m just saying, if any guy was going to go from being like the lead of like an alt rock band to being the host of extra, you knew it was going to be him.

[00:53:19] 20220129 1127 Brett: I guess I, so I like guys, like I I’m pansexual. Um, I, I, I understand what’s attractive about males and I cannot agree with you on this.

[00:53:33] 20220129 1127 Guest: I don’t understand how you, can’t not find like at his peak. I’m not saying like some of like the, the, the, like he’s had a little too much plastic surgery and I’m not saying.

[00:53:42] 20220129 1127 Brett: I think I need personality.

[00:53:45] 20220129 1127 Guest: He has personality though. I’m just thinking, Okay.

[00:53:47] And actually I’m taking this back now. I still, I would not fuck him now. He’s had too much plastic surgery. It is, he, he is not on my like fuck list, but when I think back about like sugar Ray, mark McGrath, like, like [00:54:00] when I think about like like late nineties, mark McGrath, like,

[00:54:03] 20220129 1127 Brett: like sugar? Ray’s music though.

[00:54:06] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay. I did,

[00:54:07] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. Okay. That explains everything. Like if you can stomach the music, I can understand accepting the,

[00:54:16] 20220129 1127 Guest: kind of liked the music,

[00:54:17] 20220129 1127 Brett: characteristics of

[00:54:18] 20220129 1127 Guest: but I kind of, but I’m going to be completely honest with you. I kind of liked the music at least initially, because I thought he was super fucking hot in the, um, the, the fly video. I was like 13.

[00:54:32] 20220129 1127 Brett: I can’t, I can’t do it like bad music is bad music to me.

[00:54:36] 20220129 1127 Guest: Um, Okay. So I will say this, I did love, so they had like the huge hit with, with, um, with fly, which was the rest of the music had been nothing like that. And then fly was a huge hit. And then they came out with another album. I have to give them credit for this. Also, he was like, I think the all time champion on rock and roll jeopardy guy actually has a lot of like music knowledge.

[00:54:58] But anyway, [00:55:00] we’ll talk about dark side of the nineties in a second, but that the second that their, their, their third album meet with for That I don’t know what it was called, but I don’t remember what number it was, but I will say this, this was pretty fucking brilliant. They’d had this big hit and everybody told them, well, you’re 15 minutes of fame is.

[00:55:13] going to be up soon.

[00:55:14] So they name their album 1459, and then it had like six top 10 hits. So for that alone, I’m sorry. That’s fucking awesome. Like, everybody wrote them off as like a one hit wonder, and then they came back with like an album that. Just like, literally like one of the best-selling like rock albums for like two years in a row.

[00:55:36] 20220129 1127 Brett: Uh, I’ll give you that I will 1459. That is hilarious.

[00:55:41] 20220129 1127 Guest: Right. So, so, okay. So he is too, but anyway, let’s talk about, let’s talk about dark side of the nineties.

[00:55:47] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. So it opens up with, uh, a review of a trash TV, like Jerry Springer and Ricky lake. And he, and, and I forgot about it, but Oprah at [00:56:00] the time,

[00:56:00] 20220129 1127 Guest: yeah. Oh

[00:56:01] 20220129 1127 Brett: totally forgot Oprah was ever trashed

[00:56:04] 20220129 1127 Guest: Oh, 100% because she was following Donahue’s footsteps and Donahue went in

[00:56:09] 20220129 1127 Brett: was Jerry Springer for a while?

[00:56:12] 20220129 1127 Guest: They were doing more issues oriented, but no early Oprah, like early nineties, Oprah was trashed before she like went to like pivoted to wellness and, and, um, uh, like more like celebrity kind of stuff and whatnot.

[00:56:23] She was just really good at. Like she just elevated it. Like that is the amazing thing about Oprah. Like she, she took this trashy shit, but she elevated it to another level because Oprah is like fucking incredible as an interviewer,

[00:56:35] 20220129 1127 Brett: So here’s what I love about dark side of the nineties is they, they interview people who kind of hate each other and they allow the story story to be presented by people who don’t agree necessarily on the events that happen. And they do a really good job [00:57:00] of kind of, this is, these are the key players in this shit that happened in the nineties.

[00:57:07] And here’s why they hate each other. And I watched the one on trash TV. I watched the one on grunge rock, which was really good. And I watched the one on Pamela Anderson and Baywatch and yeah, it’s fascinating stuff. I honestly like this is my high school years. Like this is the, the period of pop culture that I was most aware of pop culture, as much as I pretended to hate it.

[00:57:40] Like I was, I was around for all of

[00:57:43] 20220129 1127 Guest: and you’re still a consumer of it. So this.

[00:57:44] is what makes me sad. Um, and I thought about this when I bought what washed with this, and then there was another one, like there was one on Netflix that covered some of the biggest media, um, I guess, um, uh, trials like trial by media. I think it was called.

[00:57:58] And like, one of them was The Jenny [00:58:00] Jones, um, uh, the murder that happened again. Um, and then like, there were some other like, uh, uh, things that were not all of them were from the nineties, but there, there were some similar kind of crossover, I guess, but some of the stuff travel media, that’s what it’s called.

[00:58:14] And it’s, um, a, um, a Netflix documentary series. Um, and, um, the, uh, But like what both of those have made me think about, but especially dark side of the nineties. Now you didn’t watch these because you were pretending that you’re too good for pop culture then. Um, but, um, VH1 behind the music and at the time ease tree hall to Hollywood story were both genuinely the early seasons of those shows where some of the best documentary television ever.

[00:58:47] And it sucks that because of probably music rights and other stuff that they’re not available on streaming. And then I’ve had a hard time finding like copies online. I’m Sure.

[00:58:56] they’re on newsgroups or torrents somewhere, but like behind the music in between. [00:59:00] What happened with both of them? Uh, what killed both of them was that they got so popular that they had to make so many, that they were doing each of Hollywood stories about shit that didn’t need a true Hollywood story.

[00:59:10] And, uh, like, you know, they were just cramming into an hour and like, you, you didn’t care. But like originally they were like two hour long things and they were well reported and they were well-researched. And like the original behind the musics again were like these two hour things and were incredible documentaries.

[00:59:25] And to your point about seeing people who hate each other talking a lot of times, like the stories of the bands, like I remember like the Fleetwood Mac one, like, you know, a lot of these things were bands who just really hated each other, but we’re still talking, you know, to the camera and we’re sharing like the rise and fall of stuff.

[00:59:40] And like the, the very first behind the music, like the one that the very first episode in the, uh, it was the pilot, I guess. And the one that kind of like got at greenlit for more episodes was a milli Vanilli. And, um, it, they got an interview with. One of the, the, um, band numbers before he committed suicide, like only [01:00:00] a few months before he committed suicide.

[01:00:02] And, you know, you talked to everybody involved about like how that fraud happened and that is still completely compelling documentary. And it, and it’s, it’s a shame to me, like, especially now that paramount plus, you know, exists and also peacock, I guess, cause because NBC owns E or universal NBC universal owns E like they parent plus, especially with the money they’re putting into that they could fucking license what they needed to license to get behind the music on streaming.

[01:00:28] And it’s a shame to me that they don’t because like, again, like it’s just really interesting stuff. Like the grunge episode made me think about that a lot because the, some of the, um, the, each Holly behind the music’s rather about some of those bands and some of that era, you would have loved that shit.

[01:00:44] If you would actually Dean to watch television in the late nineties,

[01:00:49] 20220129 1127 Brett: Well, okay. So out of all the grunge bands, the only one I ever latched onto was mud honey. And partly because they covered the Dick’s [01:01:00] hate the police. And I was like, holy shit, this band, this band gets it. And sure. I remember where I was when Kurt Cobain, when the, when the news came out,

[01:01:11] 20220129 1127 Guest: new said, yeah, I remember exactly where I

[01:01:12] 20220129 1127 Brett: I was in Dave’s guitar shop.

[01:01:14] I was looking at big Muff distortion pedals, and, and the news came on the radio and everyone was kind of in shock.

[01:01:22] 20220129 1127 Guest: I,

[01:01:22] was watching MTV with my sister’s friends. I was like 10 and, um, yeah, And, and we were in shock.

[01:01:29] 20220129 1127 Brett: like I remember it. I remember my basis telling me I was an asshole because I kind of chuckled because it seemed obvious that Kurt Cobain had died. And in retrospect, I regret that it was, it was a loss like it, it was a loss and I, I did not acknowledge it at the time.

[01:01:50] 20220129 1127 Guest: Well, no, but

[01:01:50] 20220129 1127 Brett: I was drunk.

[01:01:52] 20220129 1127 Guest: I was gonna say you were drunk.

[01:01:53] and you were what you were like, you were like 17.

[01:01:55] 20220129 1127 Brett: Um, I don’t remember 16, 17. That seems right.

[01:01:58] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay. So Yeah.

[01:01:59] So [01:02:00] you were drunk, you also were probably like, because Nirvana was so big at that point, you probably were like, fuck Nirvana.

[01:02:07] 20220129 1127 Brett: Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

[01:02:08] 20220129 1127 Guest: know what I mean? Like, like, like, like, uh, okay. Like my sister skipped school after river Phoenix died, she was so upset. She was so upset that like, she like took a sick day.

[01:02:20] Like she stayed at home from school. he was hot. I know, but that was my mom. I have to get my mom so much credit in Sonos because she, she was a really good mom, but she would also indulge her bullshit, like Kelly staying home from school because river Phoenix side. And, and I was like nine and I was like, I was like, okay, He, He like, oh, deed, right?

[01:02:44] Like you understand that, that this isn’t like some big tr I mean it’s tragic, but like motherfucker roadied, but she was just like, so obsessed. She was like, I loved him. I’m like, oh, okay. You know? Um, but, but that was that, that was like a big one for [01:03:00] her, I guess if Mark Paul Gossler guy who played Zack on saver the bell, I guess like, if he died, I, I would’ve skipped fourth grade, but, um, maybe, um,

[01:03:11] 20220129 1127 Brett: I just watch a documentary where they let Malcolm McLaren tell this story of how Sid vicious died

[01:03:18] 20220129 1127 Guest: yeah,

[01:03:20] 20220129 1127 Brett: and that’s fucked up. Like McLaren should not be the guy telling that story.

[01:03:25] 20220129 1127 Guest: No, no, but also, like, I don’t know. Well, that whole thing is so interesting. Um, to go on a tangent again, Okay. That’s another one where there was the, the, my better understanding of, um, uh, sex pistols and, and of sitting Nancy actually came from behind the music because the film, like, frankly, let’s sit off the hook a whole lot.

[01:03:50] 20220129 1127 Brett: Totally.

[01:03:51] 20220129 1127 Guest: Like, so, so like a lot of people grant included like their whole basis of all of that, like comes from and Nancy and I’m like, [01:04:00] okay, motherfucker, like raped and murdered her and then killed himself. Like, I don’t care what she did. Like,

[01:04:08] 20220129 1127 Brett: Okay. He’s not a good guy on heroin. Sid vicious was a terrible person. I have no respect for him at all, but what happened that night to me is controversial.

[01:04:21] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay. well she was dead before he was that that’s not controversial.

[01:04:26] 20220129 1127 Brett: No, that’s fact

[01:04:27] 20220129 1127 Guest: Right. So, so, so, so, so he killed.

[01:04:31] 20220129 1127 Brett: I, I, can’t a hundred percent endorsed that to me. That is an unknown, it’s a possibility for sure, but I can’t, it can’t be proven.

[01:04:46] 20220129 1127 Guest: I dunno, I w w she was, she was, she, she was dead before he was she,

[01:04:50] 20220129 1127 Brett: We’re having, we’re having an argument over someone who’s been dead for how many years? 40 35.

[01:04:57] 20220129 1127 Guest: Um, so I, yeah. [01:05:00] Uh, no, no, 40 I think you’re right. The movie was, is 35.

[01:05:02] years old, but anyway, a lot of people, like, I think, cause like the, the film, like. Kind of glorified their relationship and other stuff. And the behind the music was actually, um, uh, better.

[01:05:13] The interesting thing that also going back to the Kurt Cobain thing, fucking Courtney love was like obsessed with sit in Nancy and she would not stop. Like, she has a small role in the film, but she like wanted to be Nancy so badly that she like annoyed the hell out of like the director. Like She wouldn’t like go away and that’s why he cast her in a small role because she just wouldn’t fucking go away.

[01:05:35] And

[01:05:36] 20220129 1127 Brett: sense as Nancy.

[01:05:37] 20220129 1127 Guest: does make sense as Nancy.

[01:05:39] like I have to say, like, I can’t remember the name of the actress that, that actually played, um, uh, Nancy, uh, but like, and even weirdly now my mind I’m like, yeah, Courtney love. Right. Cause like that would have been in rec, like that would have been perfect casting, Chloe Webb.

[01:05:54] That’s it. Okay. So, [01:06:00] um, let’s talk about some TV, some Goodson.

[01:06:02] 20220129 1127 Brett: I feel like, I feel like we should save, we have another episode to do in just a few days.

[01:06:08] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay.

[01:06:10] 20220129 1127 Brett: Let’s save the rest of this good and bad TV for the next episode.

[01:06:15] 20220129 1127 Guest: Okay. All right. We’ll start with it though. Well, we’ll, we’ll get into it fairly early. Yeah. Cause, cause I, I do want to talk to you also, um, uh, one of the shows on the list, a new episode dropped last night or yesterday

[01:06:26] 20220129 1127 Brett: that be single drunk female?

[01:06:28] 20220129 1127 Guest: it would.

[01:06:28] 20220129 1127 Brett: I definitely want to talk about that. We’re going to talk about how we met your father and, and, and how the only thing going for it is it is it doesn’t have rape jokes.

[01:06:39] 20220129 1127 Guest: no. And, uh, and, and, and look, I do like Hilary Duff. We’ll talk about it. We’re, we’re saving it. We’re saving it, but Yeah.

[01:06:46] But, but we’re also going to talk about better TV, so Yeah. But, but an episode of single drunk female, uh, dropped yesterday.

[01:06:51] 20220129 1127 Brett: Awesome. This is, this is great fodder for our next episode. So in the meantime, thanks everyone for tuning in and definitely [01:07:00] tune back in. If you want to hear about what is shitty and what is great about TV right now.

[01:07:07]

[01:07:36] 20220129 1127 Guest: Exactly. Thank you so much.

[01:07:38] 20220129 1127 Brett: All right, Christina gets some sleep.

[01:07:40] 20220129 1127 Guest: Get some sleep, Brett.